A difficult decision.

Marigold

Marigold

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I'm here in Odstock hospital, Salisbury, where luckily they have a specialist plastic surgery unit.
At bedtime on Thursday my terrier was asleep on the sofa, as usual, and as usual I woke him up to move him to his overnight basket. He was all sleepy and cuddly looking, so I put my head down to stroke him, and he suddenly woke up in a panic and bit me hard on the nose.
Lots of lacerations and blood, so Tony took me to A and E in Winchester, I bled all over their waiting room for an hour before being seen at midnight. They tried and failed to stop it, so bandaged me up with a huge sausage of stuff under my nose and sent me off to Salisbury. Not in an ambulance, Tony drove me very fast whilst the blood was running out from the bandage and adding to pile of bloody tissues on floor of car. We had been told Salisbury A and E were expecting us and had all the paperwork with us to go straight in, but of course thus all had to be done in duplicate on their computer and then there was another 15 minutes wait whilst I bled over their reception floor. We got in at about 1.30 and they said they were keeping me in so Tony went home. It was about 4.00 before they stopped the bleeding, during which time my BP dropped alarmingly. I went up to the ward about 5.00 am. Of course everyone got woken up at 6.00, not that i was asleep anyway!
Yesterday i had a general anaesthetic and the surgeon did an excellent job of stitching me up together. Pity he didn't have time to do a proper facelift on the NHS at the same time! Am going home today i hope.
The surgeon said 'And what are you going to do about the dog?'
So thats the big question. Trog is 11 years old, pretty good for his age and we love him dearly. It was my fault for putting my face too near to him and not allowing for his natural reaction. But in the past he has nipped my granddaughter, luckily didn't break the skin but it was very frightening for a little kid and caused a rift in the family for some while. I do feel that his best years are behind him, and so maybe a one-way trip to the vet would be the right thing to do. But I'd always thought this would be a decision taken when his quality of life had deteriorated to the point when this would be a kind release for him, and it will be very hard to do this for a healthy dog, even one getting on a bit and rather tetchy at times.
So, my friends, not asking for advice here, but I would be grateful for some viewpoints on the situation if you can help me through this. Many thanks.
 
Terriers are by nature 'bite and hold' creatures Marigold. Guess the lesson is learned, he just reacted instinctively when disturbed. Can't see that's a reason for killing him. He may have nipped your Granddaughter, but what did she do to prompt that reaction???

Guess it's three strikes and he's out for me. Suppose the next reaction may occur when you pick him up if he is asleep and he bites your hand. I would still take that risk.
 
My view is that you unwittingly provoked this reaction from Trog.If when he bit your nose he hung on and continued with an attack then yes he would have to go but I assume he let go and this was a defence reaction of a sleeping animal.
I have 2 dogs and would certainly give them another chance.
Hope you make a speedy recovery.
 
So sorry to hear this story,this is no good.I agree with prewious posts and think he deserves another chance.I would consider howewer a trip to the wet to check if he dosent loosing his mind.Not sure if dogs could heve some sort of dimetia or something.I do not understand Why do you let him sleep on the sofa,and if you let him to do that why do you need to to move him?This is a very dificult and I think you should talk to your husband about it and decide it together the next step.
 
Thanks friends, I appreciate your input.
This is hard for me because, as you say, I fully accept that this was my fault and he was only being a terrier, perhaps waking out of a dream, and it was just a misjudged snap, as Newtoducks says, not an attack carried through. But nevertheless I'm left still with the truly awful thought of how I would feel if he ever did this to anyone else. The whole affair was so traumatic for me, not helped by the surreal journey to two hospitals in the dead of night, and blood everywhere, also it was very frightening at the time. At the moment I haven't had any sleep for 48 hours, and yesterday I got to 22 hours of nil by mouth from the time of my last drink until after the op. late on Friday afternoon, got very dehydrated, so one way and another in a bit of a mess just now. Thank goodness I'm home now - I actually felt quite afraid of my little dog at first. The funny thing was that we had just finished watching Martin Clunes lovely programme about how wonderful dogs were, and how when you stroke a dog, both the human and the dog experience a rush of oxytocin which makes you feel all peaceful and loving and lowers your BP. So I suppose that was what made me feel all cuddly and get too close. Trog had watched part of the programme with interest, he likes the TV, but got bored before he got to that part. Funny, he's not interested in the obedience classes on the TV from Crufts, either.
I guess I'll feel better able to think straight in the morning. Went down to the chickens when I got home. A bit of quiet clucking was very soothing, and nobody tried to peck me.
Husband horrified at the thought of losing Trog, which helps as I didn't know what he would think.
 
Firstly I am so sorry to hear that you are poorly and hope you make a speedy recovery without too much discomfort.
Regarding Trog, and this is more of a feeling, he is your dog and you love him. If you are not too frightened by the whole experience, and feel that you can manage any risks to yourself and anyone else in the future with confidence then well let him be...it is your decision ultimately, no one else can make that for you. The main thing is that you are OK.
 
Hi Marigold.
So sorry to hear about your horrible experience. I'm not a doggy person myself, but I'd have to concur with everyone else, & couldn't put it better than Foxy.

Hope you're soon feeling better.
 
Oh ,Marigold I do think that you need to take care of you first now and try to drink at least.It is better to wait at least a week until you and you hubby made a decision just to cool things down a bit.I think I know what other member of you family would say,but you first need to be happy with what you going to decide and from what I'm seeing I think Trog will be with you for a bit longer.I wish you speedy recovery :-)17
 
Still feeling a bit sleepy from the anaesthetic and lack of sleep, but Trog keeps coming and checking on me, attracts my attention, has a good sniff and I scratch his ears and then he goes away, back to sleep again.
I was so grateful for your unanimous advice. I would most probably have come round to that view myself when home again, but it was very supportive of you all to say so, loud and clear. Isn't this a great forum, where you can get advice and support from so many people you probably won't ever meet, and not only about chickens? Thank you everybody.
I do look like something out of Roald Dahl at present though, with green whiskers from the stitches sticking out at odd angles all over my nose. Not painful at all though and I expect it will heal up beautifully. Not posting any high- definition photos, however!
 
Hi Marigold, So sorry to hear of your problems, things always seem so much worse at night. I was surprised you had to wait so long to be seen as usually if someone is bleeding they deal with it as a matter of urgency.

Sorry this is a "bit behind the fair" but lightning took out my computer and the wireless router on Thursday morning so this is my first occasion back on line.

I understand your fears that maybe he would do this to someone else but that's where, as pet owners, we have to try and protect our pets from what they may see as aggressive behaviour. Most of the scratches I have had are a result of me doing something daft, or the cats just being cats. I'm glad you have allowed yourself time to reflect - knee jerk reactions are never a good idea.

Hope you feel better soon - you are a spoilsport not letting us see the green whiskers!
 
Oh Marigold, so sorry to hear what happened, :o like you I would blame myself & would stiill give trog another chance. our old springer (nearly 17 when he passed last week :cry: ) was deaf, nearly blind & had signs of dementia. However, if he had bitten us we also would have blamed ourselves for making him jump while sleepy etc.

Cyber hugs to you & yours, hope you are feeling a bit better.
 
Thanks so much for the kind message. I'm very sorry to hear about your dog, its such a wrench when they go, hard for anyone who hasn't had a dog long-term to understand. When our previous dog was killed by a speeding van on a tiny country road at the age of only 4, we were both quite ill for a long time. We then had to wait 4 months for Trog to be born and grow up enough to live with us, and this seemed a very long dogless time. Your boy did really well to get to 17, didnt he? Somehow they leave a bigger hole in the family even than a person in some ways because the years of love and friendship are so unconditional and simple. You made me realise yet again how lucky I am to still have a dog lying on my feet as I write.
We always forgive them, and blame ourselves, don't we, when things go wrong. Trog is still following me around and checking that I'm OK. Now I'm recovering, of course were back to normal, no more talk of the vet for my little teddy bear.
Nose coming on nicely, thank you, quite comic now the swelling has gone down and the blue 'whiskers' are sticking out ever more prominently. Stitches out tomorrow though and he has done a really good job I think.
 
So glad to hear you are recovering well...the whiskers sound interesting! :) I hope you are enjoying having your feet up and resting with Trog and not spending too much time on line? :D ;)
 
omg marigold soory i havent replyed before but only just reading your post , i feel for you so much but it sounds like your recovery is going well :D .
my jack russell is 15 this year and he has all the signs of old age kicking in fast as well as dementia at times hes a right handfull especailly when out walking so most of the time hes on a long lead , but there as been times when i have woken him from a good sleep and hes snapped at me and only caught my hand i havent done it since its not fair on freaking him out and also it does hurt .
at times i have had to really consider letting jack go hes our very big powerfull dog has hes snapped out at more then one person including the grandkids but hes never drawn blood but even now they will not learn to leave him alone and to stop playing with him one of them constantly calls him and that only sends out the wrong signals so jack gets confused and thats when he snaps i know i should lock jack out th house or shut him in another room but thats hard when its his house and hes here to protect it , all i keep tellnig the kids is well it'll be your fault if he bites but still they carry on .
but we did lose one pup { 8 months old } quite a few years ago now he nipped my mums hand while she was trying to take elastic bands out his mouth so she decided he was going to be p.t.s agaisnt me and my dads will { he actully protected the grandkids and adored them so i know he would never of done anything to them } we went to the vet who suggested rehoming him so we took him to battersea dogs home worse thing i have ever ever done in my entire life watching him being dragged into the kennels while he was screaming at me and dragging the kennel hand back to me screwed me up beyonds words even now i struggle to cope with it but to then find out they put him to sleep within 24 hrs done me in as they reckon he turned evil no he didnt he just wanted to be back with me never ever will i support that place ever again .
letting an animal go who is old and sufdfering is hard but in one way an easy decision to make but at any other time i think for me personally its harder even harder when its your own pet .
 
That's awful Karminski; I've only had to do it when the animal was elderly and to ensure they didn't suffer any longer.

I only have cats (and chickens) but I don't think one can EVER really trust an animal. My cousin had a Chow who was as soft as butter and apparently fine with her little boy, but one day the dog went for him and badly savaged his head - the baby was at the crawling stage. Nephew had a Weimaranner which got so it wouldn't let HIM anywhere near his baby - who knows what goes on inside their heads, or what stimulus they might respond to in a "bad" way?
 
we will never ever understand an animals mind even if we think we do it will never happen they all have thier own reasons on why they do it but us humans only ever see the bad side of it and never look or try to find a reason why they did it or do it for that matter , any animal can feel threatened in any situtation so it needs to protect itself anyway it can and a dogs way is to bite like most animals but some cant bite so they kick or do something esle to protect .i have seen many times an animal turn on a human but it has always been the humans fault i have given up counting the amount of times i have had little kids run up to my dogs and the adults just let it happen or young kiddes and older ones go up and try and stroke animals they know they must not go near but then stand there an wander why the get attacked .
 
Just read this post to be both horrified at your trauma and terrified for the dog.... So glad you've still got him Marigold. Late I know, but my thoughts are that you now know the 'danger' so can take the appropriate action to make sure that both children are wary of "mr grumpy" and everyone can give the space and time to make sure both humans, and Trog, is happy and have the respect and space to live in harmony.
We all get old and less able as we age. Nobody got rid of my granny because she stuck out with her walking stick if woken in her chair for tea (we just learned to shout from the doorway, out of reach). Maybe it's time to kiss him less and try kissing hubby instead ;)
x
 
Marigold, I'm so sorry to hear about what happened to you! I know I'm way behind here, but have hardly been on here recently and am only just catching up! I hope you are all healed now and Trog is still with you! I have dogs, although not terriers, but feel exactly the same as everyone else. His natural instincts kicked in here and he was probably horrified when he realised what he had done! I don't believe dogs bite for no reason, it is always the fault of the person in any situation, not that it is always understood why a dog reacted the way it did, but that is our problem, not theirs. In your case though it was obviously human error. I trust my dogs and would probably not think twice about doing exactly what you did! I hope Trog has made it up to you!
 
Thank you, Sue, and everyone else, for your kind wishes. Sue's latest post made me revisit this thread, after a couple of months which have been rather eventful for us here. Two weeks after Trog bit me, my 97-year-old mother-in-law died, after 3 months in hospital, then discharge to a nursing home where she lasted less than 24 hours before getting out of bed in the middle of the night, trying to walk off home to her own flat we think, fell on her walker and broke her nose. Another telephone call in the middle of the night to say she was on her way back to A&E. Back to the Home, deteriorated, another A&E admission, and she died a week later. Meanwhile, the day she died I went down with a really bad dose of flu, followed by Tony, we were really out of it for a fortnight. Mine developed into a bad chest infection as well. Then Tony slipped on a kerb and broke his ankle, attended the funeral on crutches and in considerable pain. Lots of work clearing and cleaning Mums flat and getting on with probate etc, and so all this rather overshadowed our previous problem with Trog. I just put off thinking about it, both him and the chickens just got basic care in those weeks I'm afraid. We've also gone through one of those building jobs from hell where everything has seemed to go wrong and took twice as long as it was supposed to, and had to be done again.....
Meanwhile, our elder daughter's very old and much-loved dog died, and after a few weeks of waiting they have just got a lovely cuddly new puppy. Unfortunately in a way, this puppy is black, and Trog has a lifelong fear of black bouncy dogs, having been attacked by one when he was a puppy, and i know this would emerge as nervous aggression towards a bouncy black pup. Also, Sara was very much of the opinion that Trog is a dangerous dog and we should have had him put down. (It was her daughter who got nipped by Trog some years ago, and this caused a big family upset at the time, though the child was actually only frightened) and so Sara doesn't want Trog visiting, at least while the puppy is so little. I quite understand this and would feel the same myself, but it means putting Trog in kennels if we want to see them. We did this once before and I really hated leaving him there, knowing how all the barking and strange surroundings would stress him. However, I just have to keep telling myself that at least we've still got him, my nose has healed up amazingly well, and he will just have to put up with it whilst we see our family.
Anyway, have just booked a holiday for all three of us in a peaceful Pembrokeshire cottage, near St David's Head, in June. It will be really good to have a break and move on a bit. All we need now is a bit of sunshine!
 
my god and i thought i had rough times recently my heart goes out to you biggggggggggggggggg hugggs coming your way , just keep strong is all i can say .but sa for putting dogs into a kennel thats one thing i would never ever do which is why i miss out on sooooooooooooooooooooo much i cant even bare going to my sisters for xmas day and if i have to go i only stay for an hour at the most as i cant stand leaving my dogs on thier own i dont even have days out ok i know i am mad but although my dogs drive me mental they are my babies and i cant bare the thought of them being shut in for any length of time on thier own .
 
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