Laying internally?

rick

rick

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I was wondering if anyone would have some insight, confirmation (short of an impending vet visit) of what is going on with Brownie who is looking unwell again.
Two weeks ago I had her booked in for a visit to the vet and indoors to keep an eye on her because she was quiet and looking unwell (the 'puffed up' thing.) But I think this started several months ago - She has always laid enormous eggs but over the past couple of months they were consistently shaped with a bulge to one side. Then, about a month ago she had a bad turn and was passing what looked like egg but no shell in evidence and after a couple of days seemed OK again. I don’t think she has laid since although her vent has the appearance of a hen in lay. Two weeks ago she was looking bad and I had her booked in but, again, got through it by the next day and I cancelled the appointment.
Now she's in the same state again - passing egg. Doing the vent pulsating thing, puffed up and, interestingly, drinking a lot of water I notice.
She's not walking like a penguin (and hasn’t all along) and although she keeps seeming to get through it I'm thinking this isn’t going to go away (or end well!). I think she is laying internally.
 
Poor Brownie. Doesn't sound too good, I'm afraid, Rick. Is your vet good with poultry? Maybe it's time for a vet visit - though these things always seem to come to a head over a weekend, don't they?
Do let us know how she gets on.
 
Thanks Marigold. I'm going to the local vet that's listed with BHWT and although it's not always the practitioner that's named by the trust they seem to all be well informed. Appointment asap. I'm estimating that her discomfort is about 5/10 and intermittent because she's still interested in food and mooching around with the rest half of the time but it seems worse this time and I don't think the food is going through properly. Sigh! She's had a year more than she would have had and pretty luxurious life!
But maybe the vet will have a solution.
 
Sounds like egg peritonitis I'm afraid Rick, bouts of passing egg and being ill followed by short periods of recovery and so on. Feel her keel bone, if it is very prominent this is also a sign. Unfortunately very common in the third laying season for commercial hybrids and I have already lost a number of the exbatts this spring.
 
Thanks dinosaw.
She's running around and eating this morning - I hope I'm not crying wolf here (and also hoping I am) but something is going wrong in there. The others were following her around yesterday to get the egg she was passing. (sorry, not a detail you want at breakfast time!)
I'll let you know when I have the vet's opinion.
 
If she is persistently passing egg, it's pretty certain that some of it is going down the wrong way into her gut. If so, this will be in the process of decomposing internally, and brewing up to highly painful and terminal peritonitis. Exbatts are bred to produce large eggs practically every day for 18 months, after which they're 'disposed of,' as you know, partly because problems like Brownie's are so common in exbatts, they're just not bred for longevity. It's highly improbable that, with her symptoms, she will recover, and we all know how chickens do their best to hide how they're really feeling when they're ill. Perhaps the best way to approach it is to be thankful for her second chance at a really good, longer life and excellent care she's had with you, and be prepared to follow this up with a timely intervention and a peaceful end.
 
Your right Marigold, it's only so long that she can 'run the gauntlet ' like this before a serious infection sets in. Up till now I was under the impression that if something like this happened then I would have an obviously and acutely sick hen and the decision would be unfortunate but impelling. Didn't recon on this half way house scenario.
 
It sounds very typical as it can be on and off for months Rick, first time I encountered it it was with probably my favourite bird ever and to be truthful I let it go too long before I took action but you live and learn and perhaps now I'm a bit too hung ho when I spot it. I think what Marigold says is spot on about how to look at it, the only treatment I've ever come across on the net is an expensive hormonal implant or a dangerous removal of the oviduct.
 
Very sorry to hear about Brownie, Rick. You could also try the homeopathic remedy Secale. This is what a Homeopathic Vet is giving her sheep that have difficult lambing and it seems to work.
 
Thanks Chickenfan,
I'm all for trying anything, particularly holistic/preventative treatments that help avoid these things in the first place. I'm going to make an appointment with the vet as soon as they're open this morning. I think what is happening is that her uterus has become deformed so the egg isn't getting a shell and is passing into her intestine. That fits with the bulging eggs she was laying - expanding into the weak side of the shell gland/uterus.
When something similar happened to Teabag she went for the radical solution - I don't think that was a lash egg she laid now, she shed her whole oviduct lining and moulted heavily a bit like that old trick I read about to reset a hens system when she stops laying. Teabag was very lucky!
This is a different sort of problem, I think, and I'm not going to subject Brownie to the painful roulette wheel that Teabag took herself on (you'll be pleased to know!).
 
Birds don't have a uterus, see diagram here https://poultrykeeper.com/reproductive-system-problems/the-reproductive-system-of-a-chicken/

Anyway, good luck with the vet visit today, Rick, I know you want the best for her. Let us know how you get on.
 
Secale is for expelling/sloughing loose parts of the body. Wishing you very good luck this evening.
 
I was dreading that but I brought her back home! Whatever I say in the future please say 'Rick tour talking rubbish' but I'm very pleased to be wrong.
What I assumed was bits of yoke in white is yellowish but not yellow enough. It's not egg apparently.
She has got an inflammation in her vent with some thing the vet described as 'maybe cists' (so poss not out of the woods yet)
She has been given a Metacam injection for the inflammation and Denagard as an antiseptic.
Such a relief. Shell get to meet the boy after all :)
 
That's fantastic news Rick! Interesting that Denaguard can be used on a chicken. It sounds an uncomfortable problem.
 
Glad it's not egg Rick and she gets a bit more time.
 
Brownie.JPG

Brownie was PTS by the vet today. I’m gutted.
She continued to lay eggs without shell or shell membrane and the infection took hold again. I was really hoping she would just go off lay but she wasn’t showing any sign of stopping. She was still lively, just appeared a bit perplexed what was happening and a little uncomfortable from time to time, but I don’t think that would have lasted long. Even Teabag couldn’t have got out of that one!
 
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