Sour Crop help

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GemmaEllen

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One of my girls has sour crop, and I wanted to see if anyone had any new ideas of how to treat it? I've not dealt with it before so this is a first for me.

Maggie was quiet on saturday, and spent all day sunday facing a corner, sleeping. She showed no interest in food - even her favourite stuff. I checked her crop and it was full.
Monday morning, I checked her crop again, and it was still full. it felt like a water balloon. I vomited her, and some stuff came up, including the white blobs that I took to be sour crop. I didn't get her empty.

The rest of the day, she was quiet and sleepy, still not eating. every so often she would get up and drink water, and eat grit. I fed her yakult which she drank quite happily. I massaged her crop on and off throughout the day. she put herself to bed early.

Yesterday (tues) her crop was still not empty in the morning, but it wasn't filled like a balloon as before. it was soft and a little squishy. I started her on thrush cream. she had a dollop on her tongue, I massaged her crop, and went to work. I came home and found her a lot more active. she was out grazing with her sister - although I noticed she wasn't eating grass - only looking for grit underneath. she had laid every day up until then, but there was no egg. (but, I didn't get an egg from Gracie either - sometimes they take a day off) I tried her on the yakult (although I'm not sure if the thrush cream and the yakult will counter each other?) but she wasn't interested. she did eat some scrambled egg and olive oil, and even nibbled at a bit of Gracie's grain. she put herself to bed early again.

This morning, its much the same. her crop is still not empty - and is now full of all the grit that she's been eating. I've given her the thrush cream, and a couple of energy drops, and she's gone out with Gracie, and is cleaning her feathers quite happily. she went to the food I put down, but didn't eat it.

She seems very good at not eating stuff that wont help her, but is searching for something that will?

My question is, how long will it take for her gizzard to deal with whatever is stopping her crop from emptying? I assume its long grass, as we had a lot of it in 'the meadow' this year - and its her favourite place to sit.

Also, she is eating grit - I assume to help her gizzard digest the grass - but its not moving from the crop, and all she's doing is fulling her crop up. should I empty this? or is it ok for it to be there? other than the scrambled egg, she's not eating at all, but no longer seems lethargic.

I should add, I've no changed her feed to a different brand, I've not wormed her, I've not dusted for mites. would any of these things help?

she is not pooping either - only clear liquid types with creamy bits in. occasionally there is some brown stuff (not red) one yesterday was even a bit foamy?

Does anyone have any suggestions of what I can do to help her?

I know the vomiting is dangerous, and don't really want to do it unless I have to (Monday I was desperate as the crop was so huge)

Any suggestions gratefully received as she's a dear chicken. I've been googling frantically but there is so much conflicting info out there, its hard to know what is best!
 
Sounds like the digestive system is impacted and the crop has gone sour, so sour that it has gone to proper sour crop with fungal growths -the creamy bits. Obviously she is desperately hungry, but eating stuff that won't pass through. If it is a gizzard impaction with grass I doubt it will shift -we've had two. Certainly you need to stop feeding her with anything that feeds the fungus, so I would suggest water only. I read recently that the fungus can be treated with neat vinegar, but how much you give her I don't know -perhaps just 5mL?

As you say the vomiting is dangerous but the crop needs to be kept clear. Water only and stop her eating anything is what we did, but if the blockage is going to shift it may take up to a month of treatment. Good luck. We now never put chickens first time onto grass until they have filled their crops with pellets.
 
HI Chris,

Thanks for replying.

The thrush cream will treat the sour crop - it has Clotrimazole which will kill off the bad bacteria. I read on another forum that it also helps lubricate the gizzard to help the passing. (it doesn't harm the bird either)

She's laid another egg today, and seems fine except for the fact she's not eating anything other than grit, and the scrambled egg she gets once a day.

I'll keep her nutrients up with nutri-drops and hope that I can keep her weight up long enough for her body to flush the grass out of her system I guess. She is pooing (although only the clear white stuff) which I think means its not a complete impaction?

You said the crop should be kept clear - does this mean you think I should get all the grit she's eaten out? (vomit her again?)
 
The grit is fine, just avoid anything that can go sour in the crop. I'm amazed she is laying, so something must be going through. The white is the urinates component, so the water is getting out but not much solids. Sounds like it will clear though -perhaps some grit will get through and start grinding. It is normal to have a little grit in the crop, but too much risks a pendulous crop- one that stretches with the weight and then won't empty properly. We had an Orpington with that condition- it's almost always the piggy Orpingtons that are sick!
 
I have heard of people giving a small bit of a thrush tablet (flucanazole) before but the cream is a new one on for me, let us know how you get on with it. I would continue with what you have started in the yoghurt and cream as it is possible that the other remedies such as red wine/vinegar, garlic, bicarbonate of soda etc will not be complimentary with what you are already doing. Fingers crossed for you but if it is indeed a gizzard impaction as Chris has said the outlook isn't great, good luck.
 
thanks for the replies!

I should add that Maggie is a rescue chicken, along with her sister, Gracie. (I posted about a dog attack on Gracie just about a year ago now - where the dog pulled a patch of skin off her back. she recovered fully and is a happy, healthy chicken, albeit with a stiff wing!)

I'm happy to care for her and will do what it takes to make her better and understand that this sort of thing tends to be a long, drawn out process. I have found a vet in the area via the BHWT, who I'm hoping can assist if she deteriorates, but she currently seems ok (a bit slower than usual, and settling down to sleep a bit more often, but otherwise alert, responsive, and as friendly as ever!)

having just got home, I've had another massage of her crop. it seems to be a better shape today - less pliant and a bit cooler than it was before. its still full of grit though. I've read into pendulous crop and will vomit her again if it gets big like it did before. I compare it against Gracie's and they are about the same size, although Gracie's feels firmer and is empty every morning. as long as it stays that way, and she continues to be fairly normal, I'll have to let her sort it out in time I guess! (although I'm a terrible worrier, so I don't see me getting much sleep for the next month!)

I've heard about the garlic - what does that do, exactly?

I understand Bicarb as a natural remedy for UTI's in humans - perhaps I could try adding that to her water too.

her poo is a little yellow sometimes. does that suggest infection? are there any natural remedies that will help if it is?

I'm also assuming a stool softener (like a human product) would be no use here?

just trying to cover all the bases here...
 
Garlic is a anti-fungal and an anti-bacterial which as Tim points out on his page is rated highly by the pigeon fraternity my brother in law included. It would probably work against the probiotic yoghurt by killing the good bacteria in it as it doesn't discriminate so I would say use one or the other but not both. As far as I understand it vinegar/red wine/ bicarb all work by altering the acidity and oregano oil has anti fungal properties. You could also get an anti fungal from the vet of course, at least it does sound like you haven't got a compacted gizzard on your hands if she is perking up.
 
quick update:

DH came home and said she seemed much better today - she's been mooching about with Gracie rather than sticking to one spot, and she still rushes over to see us as usual, which is nice. :)

she did have a bit of a nap earlier though - I sat out with them for a bit after I got home and she settled down next to me for a kip whilst Gracie pecked at the grass beside her.

This evening we gave her another dollop of thrush cream, and a few drops of nutri-drops, and a quick massage (although not for long as she wouldn't stay still!) She wasn't interested in the scramble tonight, but I noticed she was pecking at Gracie's feed for a bit. Then she toddled off to bed - an hour or so earlier than Gracie. (Although, Gracie is usually the last one up - it's just usually more like 10 minutes later, rather than an hour!)

I'm still so worried that she just wont wake up tomorrow - I've been at work today so haven't been able to monitor how much she's drinking or anything... having a poorly pet is the worst...!
 
Morning update!

She toddled out of the coop this morning, and seemed quiet. I've had a feel of her, and her crop does feel smaller - you can feel her boney bit underneath it now, but there is still a good handful of what I assume is grit over on one side. it doesn't seem to be too heavy or hanging down yet.

She's did a lap round her water bowl but didn't drink (although there is water inside the coop too, so she may have had some of that before we let her out)

we gave her the thrush cream, and I got a few nutri-drops in her, but she's getting fed up of the man-handling, and struggled to be let go.

She didn't touch her egg, or her yakult, but did eat a small handful of dried mealworms in coconut oil (not the best thing for her - but its food!) she also nabbed a bug/spider.

on a positive note, she did pass a long thin poo this morning! it was about 1.5 inches long and tapered off at the end. On further inspection, it was made up of long fiberous strands of what looked like grass, with a splash of white, and a thing that looked like a flat piece of grit (very thin, and quite small)

It looks like there might be another, smaller one in the coop too (they both sleep in nesting boxes as they are ex-batt. I've never been able to break them of the habit!) 10 minutes later she passed a very small wet one.

so what is my next step? as she is beginning to pass the block, is she out of the woods? or is the not eating my next problem? she is quieter this morning, huddling down and sleeping already, but it is much colder this morning.

For reference, its been 5 days since she's not been eating properly, so I imagine she's just lacking nutrients and tired. (being poorly is tiring for anyone!)

can she function on the minimal amount she's eating? or do I need to step in and assist more than I'm doing?
 
hi Gemmaellen, glad there's good news this morning.
If she struggled, that's a good sign. Just try to avoid any more handling than necessary if it stresses her. You can't make a chicken eat, only provide a variety of tempting treats for her, as you're doing. Try a warm damp mash of pellets, mixed with high protein extras - will be easier to eat and also provide some water along with food. Water is more important and you may need to try syringing a little into her beak, but take care not to choke her as hens cannot cough it up.
Although this may have been caused by eating long grass etc, you have to realise that ex batts are all on borrowed time in their second homes, lucky girls, and the crop problem may be a symptom of something else wrong in her digestive system. (When were they both last wormed with Flubenvet?) Best thing is to provide suitable food and leave her in peace to rest, as you're doing.
BTW, the splash of white in her poo is normal, it's the urates, in other words, chicken urine. They have only one exit hole and like all birds, pass urine as white splashes in with their poo.
Grit isn't stored in the crop but in the gizzard, further down, where it grinds up solid food, so what you're feeling is probably left over food or maybe the tail end if her blockage.
 
HI Marigold! Thanks for replying. :)

I've not wormed them in a while (probably 7-9 months or so?) but have the flubenvet ready to go now. Just got to get Maggie back up to eating before I can give it to her. she has had some lettuce since my previous post, which I hope will help with the water. She's settled down for a nap on the conservatory floor now. (it is cold this morning, so brought her in until it warms up a bit.)

I guess I just keep going with her, and see how she gets on - but looking back, there is a huge improvement since sunday. (when she was lethargic and her crop was full of liquid) It's just frustrating to have to stand by and watch her deal with it on her own. My natural instinct is to help her get better quicker, but perhaps time is the only healer in this case. :/
 
another update before I go to work. (bored of me yet?) I added some milk and water to their usual mash, warmed it slightly, and offered it to both girls with a sprinkle of meal worms. Gracie dug in, and Maggie tentatively picked at the mealworms, before deciding she liked it. she's picking delicately through it, but I can see she's eating it which will help. :) I feel that she's eaten and drank enough now that I can go to work and leave her to it now... :P
 
Once Maggie is eating regularly, even if not her usual amount of pellets, you can try worming them in small doses rather than just treating their pellets and leaving them to get on with it. If her appetite isn't back to normal, she won't eat enough Flubenvet to deal with any worm burden she may have.
For two hens, you would normally need to mix one level scoop of Flubenvet powder into 2 kilos of pellets and feed only that for 7 days. Alternatively, you can make up a treats mix of things they are 100% sure to enjoy, such as sunflower seeds, mealworms, and mixed corn. Get a small container, about 200ml, and measure out the treats mix into 7 fillings of this. Bind it together with a light dose of vegetable oil to help the powder to stick to the treats. Mix well, then add the measure of Flubenvet. Mix well. Then feed them one container full measure per day, sprinkled on a big plate, and watch to see its going down. You may need to separate them to be sure that Maggie has time to eat her full dose. Feed it when they're likely to be hungry, first thing in the morning is best if you can remove the normal feeder overnight. Ideally, if using this method you would split it into two doses, morning and evening, but the important thing is to get it into them, especially Maggie. At least you will be able to see if she's getting what she needs and is enjoying it.
As they haven't been wormed for quite a while, it would be good to repeat the treatment three weeks later, to ensure you've fully cleared any lingering worming problems. Then keep up the Flubenvet every 4-6 months.
 
Another update! Hoping it will be my last. Maggie seems to be doing fine now. she passed a lot of grass and undigested seed overnight, and seems fine this morning. there is still a small amount of grit in her crop, but I assume this will continue to get smaller, and I've stopped treating her with the thrush cream to give her some peace. she's eating now, small amounts but its an improvement on nothing, so I'm hoping that with some R&R she will be fine.

I'm going to give her the weekend and then start the worming treatment from monday. Thanks for everyone's help on this one!
 
That's very good news, my advice would be not to start worming on Monday, give her another week to recuperate as when the worms are killed they release toxins, the higher the worm burden the higher the amount of toxins and this in itself can make the bird ill so better safe than sorry if she is already weak.
 
Just a final update on this one - Maggie recovered fully from her sour crop, and is back to running about, calling for me if she see's me in the house, and laying eggs like normal. :D I was lucky that she wasn't entirely impacted, and just had to treat the sour crop until her body could cope with all the grass she'd eaten. its a long process, but worth it to see her back to normal!

:-)08 :D

:-)99
 
Glad to hear it all turned out well for the pair of you, another victory for perseverance. :-)17
 
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