Puffed up quiet chicken not laying

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Nigella.jpg I have one chicken (Nigella, don't laugh) the black one in the pic who suddenly looks poorly, looks puffed up, double the size of her companion Fanny, the white one. Her red comb is pale pink, looks brighter in pic but def pale. There has been a few runny eggs laid and one came out just the soft shell of the egg. Her poo looked like it had blood in it and looks quite yellow not like her friends, also see in pic on the right hand side.Nigella poo.jpg

I'm new to chickens got them 6 months ago, young ones, had 3 and Delia died within 2 days (probably trauma at point of lay) although she did have runny nose, bubbles etc and think it could have been a respiratory disease.

Have been feeding pellets and water with Citricidal in it, haven't done the garlic this month but will try that too now.

Any ideas, it's like a needle in a haystack trying to work out what's wrong? She sits on her perch at night, but quiet last two days not rushing round the garden pecking and not laying eggs.

We also think that Fanny (the white one) is laying strange eggs they either have a hole in them see pic, Eggs with holes.jpg or have like a nipple. excuse me) on them. eggs.jpgANy discussion would be welcome, thanks!

Mrs Tweedy (Pip)
 
Have now thouroughly cleaned out hen house, given them ready brek with garlic and citricidal in it but Nigella not really interested. Going to get Flubenet tomorrow and worm them both.
 
Hi MrsTweedy / Pip, welcome to the forum.

I have moved your post from the photos forum to the Chickens Health forum ;)

One thought for you:

Blood in the droppings can be a sign of Coccidiosis which is an internal parasite called Eimeria. These live inside the cells that line the birds intestine. As they reproduce, they cause bleeding and swelling in the intestines. Birds loose a lot of liquid through diarrhoea and cannot absorb nutrients from their food and will soon die if left untreated. Coccidiosis normally only infects young birds. Older birds will build up an immunity over time. There are a few different kinds and there is more information on this on the Poultry Diseases and Disorders page under the "Digestive" tab.

I would take her to your vet for advice on this. They should be able to confirm it with a faeces Cocci sample and suggest a suitable treatment. It is of course very easy to say what it 'could be' but a vet should be able to do a propper diagnosis.

The first lot of eggs with 'holes' must surely be peck holes? Do you ever find broken eggs? Hens will soon get a taste for yummy eggs and it's a difficult vice to break once they get started. Perhaps you can try to collect them early in the day as they are laid and check?

I've seen eggs with 'bumps' and irregularities / excess shell like the bottom photo from some of my girls before and they have seemed to be perfectly healthy. I don't believe that's anything to worry about.

Worming is a good idea - although I would get the hen checked for possible Coccidiosis first. There have been lots of people suffering with it this year. :(
 
It is soooo difficult to fathom sometimes what is wrong with our chooks, usually this requres a thorough examination by a vet.
Droppings can give us a clue however, in some cases. With you hen it looks like she may not be eating much or has a kidney problem linked to her illness or as a consequence, the watery droppings look like they have an abnormal proportion of urates (white substance that in normal droppings looks like a white cap and excreted through the kidneys) cocci infection can also look like this, more common in younger birds usually higher mortality up to around 12 weeks and a more chronic outcome after that.

The other area that may possibly be a problem is the fact she is laying soft shelled eggs, this is not uncommon in new layers the reproductive sysytems of young hens can have a few "blips" in the early days. As long as the diet is balanced this usually resolves itself naturally, however, certain diseases linked to respiratory infections can cause similar symptoms

Agree with Tim it might be worth a trip to the vet, treating for worms and having them checked for cocci would not be a bad idea.
 
Thanks for not deleting me Tim, I did have probs with my first post and computer refreshing will double check next time 0:-)

Okay my search for a vet that deals with chickens is on! She's out of the hen house this morning but just stood there so off to the nice vet man!

Up to now been now problems both been laying an egg a day until the last two weeks then it's been alternate days for eggs.

Thanks for the advice, I will print this out and take it to the vet with me just in case! Will keep people posted incase it helps someone else.
 
Just been down to see chicken, poo is yellow and white while the other chickens is fine, have cleaned up and disinfected again so it doesn't spread, I did notice a long clear thing looking a bit like egg white that was thin one end and thick the other and wondered if that was a worm, it was clear though, not kind of solid?
 
There's a list I have compiled of Poultry Friendly Vets - these have been either recommended or are specialist in dealing with Chickens. There may not be any in your area though. There is also The Chicken Vet- they have a number of associated practises listed. There may also be vets listed on other sites although I don't know whether they check the vets to make sure they have someone who has knowlege of poultry.

I would get her there ASAP and get a propper diagnosis.. As Foxy says, it's so hard to fatham what's wrong.

If you don't have Flubenvet in stock to use then the vet might be able to give you this or another wormer on prescription today if they suspect worms. My guess is you'll need to act fast as she doesn't sound well and will soon go down hill from here.

Good Luck and don't worry, we only delete spammers, it was just a little bit of house keeping ;)
 
One other thought on the eggs after thinking about 'soft' eggs that Foxy mentioned, was that if the shells are very thin, it might be her nail breaking the shell as she climbs out of the nest box.

Thinking again about a hen pecking them, she wouldn't stop there and would get a taste of the egg in making the hole so would carry on and eat the egg...

I'll wake up soon and get my brain back in gear :-)12
 
Hi Mrs Tweedy,

In my opinion, there could be a number of issues present here and I would firstly recommend that she sees a vet.

If the bird has recently come into lay, then it is quite normal to see some egg irregularities. However, these should not persist, and if she is older than that then it may be something else which is to blame for her symptoms.

As Tim mentioned, coccidiosis could be to blame. By taking a faeces sample and getting it tested will give you an answer. You can do this at a vets, on the chicken vet website and on other sites if you would prefer to post a sample. A vet will be able to prescribe you antibiotics which will help treat the bird if it is cocci.

However, it will be worth checking for mites as a mite infestation could make the bird anaemic with a pale comb. This may also be an answer to the blood spots on the eggs, as they could be crushed red mites, rather than blood from the chicken. The small holes in the eggs could thus be blood spots on the eggs which the chickens are pecking at.

Another more serious reason for these symptoms could be a disease such as IB, which is a respiratory disease and causes damage to the shell gland.

I hope that you find out what is causing your bird’s ill health. Please let us know how she is getting on.

Chicken Vet
 
Took Nigella to the vet this morning. They aren't experts but he suspected coccidiosis, he said her bottom was very clean though and he said she had a lovely coat. Her crop was empty he said that should feel full-ish and she was very thin, you could feel her breastbone, this shocked me as not noticed before but not picked her up for about 5 days. We had an anti-biotic injection that will kill off anything and everything and he said the Flubanet I ordered would be good, should come tomorrow and I ordered some ACV (apple cider vinegar) came home with her, looking half perky, immediately went out and bought some live meal worms, she did go for these and ate about 10 which was good but still not drinking. Have tried everything else, yoghurt, cheese, bread, pellets, water etc., the other chicken is having a right old party! Tried the meal worms again just now and not interested. (Unheard of with Nigella!)

Put her in a box on it's side in the garden and she has been pottering round but not looking great and her breathing seems a bit raspy, personally I think it's curtains but we can all but try. Going back to vet on Friday for 2nd injection, then Monday for final one. If this doesn't work will let nature take it's course.

Frustrated as first chicken died when we got them about 4 months ago, of respiratory problems, maybe as they were at Point of lay and a new home, possibly trauma, but she was sneezing/coughing a lot and bubbling and terrible breathing through the mouth only, she pegged it right in front of us and we thought it could have been a lary?something disease of which the other's would be carriers but hopefully survive.

Fanny the white one seems fine although I picked her up and she seems thin so been feeding her all the above. They have a full supply of meal pellets each day they never run out, shouldn't this be enough to fatten them.

Will worm both when the stuff comes through. We block off both their nesting boxes at night as they get dirty bottoms and the feathers fall out and this encourages them to perch which has been working. They are in a lovely coup and hen house regulary cleaned out with gravel and woodchip and a great bowl of sand and grit. Life in the hen house.jpgAll feeders and water drinkers are off the ground on hanging basket brackets although not shown in pic as was brand newly built then! . We add Citricidal to the water to stop it going green, bloomin brilliant stuff!

Just popped down to put them back in coop and she's drinking water which she wasn't before so at least she is getting fluids, perhaps those 10 meal worms gave her enough protein to boost her a bit!
 
Thanks to Tim, Chicken Vet and Foxy, I printed out a page from Chicken Vet website and Tim and Foxy's comments along with my pics and took it to the vets with me, I think it helped!
 
Chicken Vet said:
If the bird has recently come into lay, then it is quite normal to see some egg irregularities. However, these should not persist, and if she is older than that then it may be something else which is to blame for her symptoms.

Eggs have been fine up to now, no problems for 4 months, eggs nearly every day.


However, it will be worth checking for mites as a mite infestation could make the bird anaemic with a pale comb. This may also be an answer to the blood spots on the eggs, as they could be crushed red mites, rather than blood from the chicken. The small holes in the eggs could thus be blood spots on the eggs which the chickens are pecking at.

We use red mite (the pink spray every 4 weeks) and disinfectant on all feeders and eaters and scrib the hutch and don't let them back in until all dry and vented. The eggs don't have blood spots, there was only blood in the chicken poo.

Another more serious reason for these symptoms could be a disease such as IB, which is a respiratory disease and causes damage to the shell gland.

I hope that you find out what is causing your bird’s ill health. Please let us know how she is getting on.

Chicken Vet
Click to expand...

Thanks for the suggestions I will keep an eye out, vet said no red mite though, could be altogether something different inside like organ failure? These fluffy little creatures keep us guessing don't they! I really thought keeping chickens would be simple but my learning curve is expanding each week! :)
 
My fingers are crossed for her. I am pleased she is drinking since she won't last long without water.

Just one thing - I've not come across Citricidal and I'm not sure what it is but I would make sure they get fresh drinking water. A daily change is good but if not at least every other day..

Unless I'm mistaken, Coccidiosis is not caused by bacteria and therfore does not respond to antibiotic treatment. She would need a Coccidiodtat - but then again, the vet would need to run a faeces sample to be sure it's Coccidiosis. If you see more blood in the faeces, I would consider getting a test done through your vet or by post (chicken vet does one for example that doesn't cost too much).

Good Luck.

Tim
 
Just a thought Mrs T-------if she has an intestinal infection/problem then feeding cheese/milk
or other dairy produce might be exacerbating the problem ,chickens are not able to digest lactose .Ros
 
Morning, thanks for your replies, every little helps! Well Nigella is still with us, been a hands on, full on experience so far!

Just been out again and fed them scrambled egg, bread, meal worms and chopped up greens with added diluted ACV and garlic, was suprised to find Nigella had made it to the outside perch we had built for them, she also made it in the hen house by herself last night, the night before I had to take her in and her eyeleids were closing, I really thought she was going to peg it by the morning. ANyway she is still puffed up but drinking water (the citricidal is totally natural, no chemicals, Citricidal is a natural anti-viral, anti-bacterial, anti-parasitic and anti-fungal derived from grapefruit seeds has a whole range of applications for ultimate microbial protection.) and stops the water turning green and does them the world of good! Even so we change the water every 3 days, at the moment changing every 2 days and cleaning everything each time. Poo is still coming out yellow and white but no blood anymore at all. Looking almost perky this morning, cleaning and preening, and EATING! Just saw her eat two lumps of scrambled egg and shell topped with live meal worms, also have been watching her drink quite a lot of water.

Back to the vet tomorrow and Tim I will ask him about what you have said.

On the conversation with dairy products, how do chickens get their protein to lay their eggs? I was reading on here a lot of people give them yoghurt, up to now they have only had chicken pellets, bread, and have the greenery out of my garden. Will not give them yoghurt etc til I've heard back from someone, I read on a chicken advice sheet that they eat everything?

Will keep you posted! The bad news is my 5 fish in the aquarium died! Gutted, the heater went wrong and my dog ended up in the vet yesterday with a bacterial infection caused by the dog groomer! The vets telephone number is like a hotline number in this house! :o)

Thanks for everyone's advice!

My best friend runs a pet supplies shop, he doesn't sell this but one of his customers who keeps lots of chickens swears by it!
Link to citricidal is: http://www.swindon-pulse.co.uk/?id=92
Pip - aka MrsTweedy, head of chicken farming, mother of two guinea pigs, two chickens, 2 dogs, minus 5 fish and running a full time graphic design business from home, and you think your life is busy :o)
 
I'm pleased to hear she seems a little more perky today. The fact she is eating and drinking is a good sign.

Thanks for the info on citricidal. Yes, many people think I'm mad but fresh water is the medicine people often forget and green water containers are basically bacteria soup!

On the protein front - yes, eggs and feathers are mainly protein. The protein usually comes from the formulated feed you give to them - this is why you should only feed a handful of mixed corn per bird per day as a treat - wheat is very low in protein (it varies but say 10%) and maize (the yellow bits) provide fat. Useful in very cold weather but will soon give you fat hens at other times. Fat hens don't lay eggs and neither do hens with a lack of protein... which is why they usually stop laying when they go into moult and regrow their feathers.

There are other sources of protein - insects, bugs, worms etc being a natural one of course.

Sorry to hear about the fish. I'm hopeless with fish too if it's any consolation but a failed heater isn't your fault I guess ;)

Oooohh graphic design .. hmm I might ask you a few questions some time :oops: I struggle with some things on the site.

Tim
 
The wormer turned up by post a 60g pot so not too big, I carefully read the instructions armed with my massive marigold yellow gloves, I ended up using about 6 various shaped containers to mix the 6g of wormer into 2Kg of pellets, got in a right old mess, (I'm the same with cooking) but relieved that I could now get wormer into them. Took it down to the hen coup and greeted the hens with my "Hello Ladies" Nigella looked at it and cocked her head and I said a prayer and she started pecking at it! Hallehuia! Fanny just thinks the whole thing is great celebrating at every individual dish of food I take down there!

The one thing that did upset me and I thought it didn't look good is Nigella started pecking at some food on the floor then did a little throw up and about a teaspoon of dark green ivy coloured liquid came up, I've never seen this happen before? Any ideas, I can't imagine it being good being dark green?

She does look perkier, her comb has got red in it now instead of pale skin colour her eyes are brighter and she is looking around a lot instead of standing there looking sleepy. I live in hope! Just willing her to get better, I know she is a £12 chicken but she has provided such entertainment and lots of lovely eggs she deserves better! Back to the vet tomorrow morning for another anti-biotic injection, going to print this out take it with me so I am armed!

Any graphic design tips I can help you will I will do. Not great on websites though, I know the basics! Better on designing them rather than construction, I leave that to the professionals! Your doing a fine job although saving a pic at 90 x 90 pixels and being 6Kb has always been the bain of my life! :-)07
 
Forgot to say, Delia R.I.P. who died of a respiratory disease was a Plymouth Rock, Nigella (who is ill) is a Barred Rock hen cross Rhode Island Red and Fanny is a light Sussex.
 
Wahooooo! Just let the chickens out, late this morning as got drenched walking the dogs, pulled up the door and Nigella shot down the ramp straight for the food doing an impression of roadrunner crossed with woody woodpecker when she got to the food! Tis good as I know she will be consuming the wormer, looks have the puffed up size she looked yesterday and although her poos are still runny, yesterday they were pure egg yellow today they are brown and looking more solid! Still a long way to go and she could go backwards but definately looking positively perky!

Let's hope the rain doesn't get her down, it's teaming here!
 
That's great news. Not sure if you subscribe to our newsletter but I did a step by step photo of how I worm my girls - all rather basic but it was ages before someone told me how to mix the flubenvet with the pellets and get it to stick!

Poultrykeeper Autumn Newsletter

I hope the news keeps getting better about Nigella!

I use photoshop at the moment for the photos on the site - it's great for cropping and reducing the image and file size but I struggle with cutting out hens (takes me hours!) and that's about the limit of my abilities! I'm going to attempt a new 'business card' this afternoon so I have something to give people at the shows over the coming weeks... wish me luck!

Tim
 
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