Poorly Peckford - Any ideas please?

Sorry Sandrine I got it into my head that Peckford was old. He has certainly packed a lot into the year. Does sound like some sort of infection. Sorry to hear about Doris, you are having a run of bad luck at the moment. It happens to us all
 
Sorry to hera about Doris, but what a lovely way to go. When my time comes, I hope to spend the day running up and down the garden for fear of missing anything, and then go to sleep and just not wake up next morning.
 
A friend of ours went in a good way. He had his Sunday roast and his wife asked if he wanted apple pie and custard, he said yes poured a glass of wine, when his wife came back in he was dead in the chair, massive stroke. Dreadful shock for her, but even she said it was a good way to go, as he had a horror of having some lingering disease.
 
I do share your ideas about a more pleasant way to go!

Booboo the girl I isolated with Peckford rejoined the flock a few hours later. She didn't really have a problem in the end - other than being greedy! I think this whole thing is making me paranoid and I see impacted crop everywhere lol

Peckford carried on declining on Saturday. I force fed him water (well actually cold mint infusion) on the Friday night, massaged his crop some more, tried to help him clear it, clean up his nose which was quite "green", and he was struggling to breathe. I only gave him mint infusion and grit, no food and left him as comfortable as possible on Saturday to rest, after cleaning him up again so he could breathe better. He really looked a ghost of himself and I thought he was not going to make it passed that day or night.
But he did! Sunday morning, he was awake early and definitely much perkier. He had colour in his face again, after having gone almost white on the Saturday. His nose was almost still clean. Really completely different! And he was really hungry as well, which was also good news because he's not eaten much at all...
He continues to improve, but I am still keeping him isolated for now. He had a roam in the garden with the girls this evening for a little while. They all ran up to him which was lovely to see. He is still quite weak though for now, despite eating again. He's not as sleepy which is also good.
Is there anything you would recommend I gave him to try and help him gain his strength and his weight back?
 
Wow! I don't think anyone will have seen that coming! His symptoms have been dire!
Nothing special required - good quality layers pellets made into mash, some yogurt to help with healthy gut bacteria (they will have been totally wiped out), some cabbage, a bit of scrambled egg is always a good pick me up - but mostly if he is eating again then fingers crossed for him being on the mend.
It sounds like a bacterial or viral infection that maybe he just managed to beat. Do keep him isolated until he is right as rain.

Mix scratch grain with the mash - as he is a fella it wont matter if the calcium levels are reduced. Actually I often do that for the hens with no effect but they do have oyster shell for a top up. Remember to give him grit.

My money would be on an air sac infection. He's lucky, very lucky if he has turned it around.
 
Thank you Rick for that I shall do my best to give him all this to help him. I've let him have a roam again tonight as he is even better and also all day in a cage can't be fun for him or his legs. His tail is up, he's not gone to sleep in the middle of the garden , he's got good colours. He's even moaned at me when I was taking too long to put him down. I can't remember the last time he made any sounds! He's even ran up to some mixed corn. His nose is still a little runny but nothing like it has been.
Now his only problem (other than keep getting better) is Dodo one of the newer girls... She bullies him, and he's too gentle to retaliate...
 
Glad to hear it all sounds so positive. Chickens have an incredible immune system (they need it) but are also very high performance in the respiratory department. All birds are (well most) with their air sacs, pump through lungs, hollow bones etc. It means that a respiratory infection can spread almost anywhere very easily once it gets a hold.
Bullying can drag a bird slowly down through stress (as can red mite etc.) The only fix I know of for bullies is having a run with an open ended screen or two so there is always a place to go out of sight of the oppressor but always with a way forward without getting cornered. Having a couple of feeding points a few feet apart is also good as no bully can be in two places at the same time! My CLB Mo is a bit of a crazy moody type who picks on my Orpington, especially on the perch. I've taken to having three perches parallel to each other and only separated by a few inches (not usually considered enough) but it gives them all enough options to avoid most of the roost time squabbles and that silly musical chairs game when they are all trying to be in the ideal order on a single linear perch (there never is an order that suits all!)
Anyway - Really good news for Peckford! Sounds like he may be due an upgrade fro 'Star' to 'Legendary' :)
 
rick said:
Glad to hear it all sounds so positive. Chickens have an incredible immune system (they need it) but are also very high performance in the repository department. All birds are (well most) with their air sacs, pump through lungs, hollow bones etc. It means that a repository infection can spread almost anywhere very easily once it gets a hold.

Anyway - Really good news for Peckford! Sounds like he may be due an upgrade fro 'Star' to 'Legendary' :)
Click to expand...

"Respiratory dept.?" Autospell strikes again!
 
Lol on the autospell ?

I think it's time for Peckford to rejoin the flock now. Still has a bit of a runny nose but it's not constant and his behaviour around the girls is much better, he walks tall again, doesn't fall asleep, doesn't fall over (bless him he was so weak on his first couple outings that he couldn't jump on the smallest border without falling over - his legs simply couldn't carry him). Dodo isn't interested in bullying him anymore either.
He's not really enjoyed the mash but he's been eating plenty again. So pleased with how he's managed to turn the situation around.
We have lost Booboo earlier this week too. She was falling asleep a lot the last few days, looking for places to hide in the garden. Still running up and down like Doris did . The colour of her head was changing constantly from dark red to pale pink but she seemed ok otherwise. I found her in the morning, still asleep, also just like Doris. She was tiny in comparison to the others, the same size as the 11 weeks old chicks we have. Like Doris she was 2 ½ years old. To be fair I've read in several sites that pekin frizzles might only live 3 years... I thought it was a relatively short life, but then they have laid a lot more than we expected (even in the winter, when the others stopped). Booboo has been Peckford favourite for a while as well, and she was often broody, so she's had a full life. Still breaks your heart though, doesn't it?
 
And he's back in the garage, in his cage... He just still isn't strong enough to go up the ladder as he has to jump up and he can't do that yet...
 
We need a <3 button on this forum (don't you think!)
It seems a lot like the new hens brought an aggressive strain of mycoplasma in with them - unfortunately.
I might be wrong - usually am! How many of your birds have shown no symptoms and sailed trough the troubles? (they are likely to be resistant and if its most then that would be very good but I'd be careful with any new introductions as those that have developed an immunity will be carriers) (if most have not shown symptoms then it is a common strain and much more likely for there to be a fairly common resistance out there.)
... Chickens are a mystery most of the time. Makes me wonder though what you might do if you had a particular bout of bacterial infection like mycoplasma where the chickens had developed a resistance - or buying in birds that look fine but might be carriers. You wouldn't want to risk early small introductions to give their immune systems chance to ramp up in case the new birds have something really nasty that will show up in quarantine. So the only thing I can think of is normal quarantine period and then maybe swapping very small amounts of food and water between them over another week or two? I'm just wondering if that would lessen the incoming impact of new exposure to the snuffles.
This must happen all the time and pass unnoticed (minor adjustment to new bacteria). I think you were probably just particularly unlucky with this one.
 
I'm afraid that the only answer if mycoplasma is inherent in the flock is an all-out policy, followed by very thorough disinfectation of the whole premises and equipment, and then re-stocking with vaccinated birds from a trusted source. Difficult if the flock are pets, as yours are, Sandrine, - which is why mycoplasma is so common in small domestic groups of chickens.
 
Are chickens from small breeders vaccinated for mycoplasma Marigold? Mareks yes, but I don't see any mention of Mg vaccination out there other than in big industry. I think just a few birds have a weak resistance to the not usually pathogenic strains (for some reason) - like Betty who had it when I got her (that's why she was in the bantam run at the breeders and a bit small for the breed - Doh!) but none of my others showed symptoms, they had never been vaccinated for anything (being hatched at school) and they had time for it to develop. The vet said at the time that vaccination (for Mareks presumably) wasn't possible as they would have to buy industrial scale quantities of the stuff and use it all quickly.
An all out policy may be something that we go in for with a small flock. There are lots of good reasons for adopting it but its not quite the same as the veterinary guidance to to industry where any signifiant drop in egg production would financially force an early termination to that years flock (insufficient return on food and maintenance costs.) They are all out by the end of the season anyway, and it will all be disinfected for the next cycle of egg production with new pullets. If my hens had to pay their way then some solid gold ones are will overdue!
 
Home-grown chicks are not usually vaccinated against anything, as you say, Rick, because the vaccine come in large batches to treat hundreds of chicks so less economic for just a few. However, the vaccine are not horrendously priced if you're a non-commercial 'pet' keeper who is willing to invest against the possibility of vets bill in the future. As I understand it, like with kids, various doses have to be given at different times in the chicks' growth, so its not easy. It also means that, to keep a small flock fully vaccinated and free of myco, you really need to buy POLs who have had their full programme of doses at appropriate ages, which means not buying chicks or young growers that might only be partially protected. It might well be OK token a closed flock and breed from these if they showed no signs of illness by their second year, but once any of your birds showed any signs of mycoplasma in future generations, you would be unable to breed from them, would be unwise to add any others from outside, and would basically be back to the original problem of what to do about it.
 
But I don't think anyone other than industry use an Mg vaccine (under licence.)(and I can only see reference to use in the USA)
https://www.msdvetmanual.com/poultry/mycoplasmosis/mycoplasma-gallisepticum-infection-in-poultry
The vaccinated birds become carriers but that's OK because they will never leave the flock, or be bred from and will be dispatched at the end of the laying season. (sounds like you've got to keep them well clear of any turkeys though.)
So it just comes down to a trustworthy breeder who is very confident that they don't have any carriers in their stock. (and have vaccinated for other things that are not Mg). A good breeder who would never knowingly pass on any poorly chickens.
And some experience viewing chickens to buy - gained through mistakes in my case!

Anyway, all I'm saying is that, yes, it would be irresponsible to knowingly move it on outside the flock but it will only develop into infectious bronchitis when immune systems are depressed (i.e. through stress) A carrier isn't infectious unless they are currently suffering from infectious bronchitis and even then it will be high concentrations of exposure that cause an explosion of infections (like in a commercial barn.) We would isolate the poorly bird. It would seem a shame to cull the ones in a domestic flock whose immune systems have a handle on it as its probably as common as the common cold out there!

Sorry to go on but I feel strongly about this - about the only place it wont be is in a commercial barn because they cant use antibiotics any more so the whole supply chain has to be squeaky clean.
 
Oh wow... So much catching up to do on this thread!!
Only two of them show the same symptoms (snuffly and on the weak ish side when it comes to jumping up... ). Peckford and Dodo (one of the new girls). Doris and Booboo didn't show any of the symptoms before they died, and only Booboo was on the sleepy side, especially on hot days. But to be honest both of them had bot been laying for a while and Peckford had been very demanding of them, eventhough they were the smallest birds. So to be fair I am quite "satisfied" that their passing would be if natural cause, though granted at a strange time. Plus they had been vaccinated before we bought them.
Peckford was bought as an egg, and didn't get vaccinated.
Dodo was bought from a smaller breeder. Doubtful that she was vaccinated. She seemed ok when she first came, started laying quickly, but isn't anymore at the moment. Her symptoms are no where near as bad as Peckford's have been.
Coco came from the same place, both are crossbreeds. She doesn't show signs of anything wrong with her. She's not laying but she is still a little young for that anyway.
Tilly we bought as an egg, same time as Peckford. Not vaccinated, no symptoms of anything, still laying currently.
Peep is one of the originals, so was vaccinated by the breeder. She was also in high demand as far as Peckford's concerned. She's not laying currently but she only lays in late winter and spring and then becomes broody and that's it... , Lol she's the mother hen of the flock...
Punky and Rosie are the youngest, Peckford's kids and Peep's. (First thought they were Booboo's, but actually I think i was mistaken) . They're almost 12 weeks old, and are very healthy. They are in a separate coop. They roam with the others in the garden, though Punky tends to fight with Tilly and Coco so they don't really mix much... Punky and Rosie are almost joined at the hip most if the time and steer clear of the others.
I have just realised that the eglu "caravan" was infested with red mites... This must have been only in the last week or so because the girls have decided to sleep outside for about as long... first time I got mites in the eglu! Didn't think it was even possible... Very difficult to spot in there... But all sorted and everyone treated too.

Peckford is perky again, put on a bit of weight, eats, drinks, dust bathes every opportunity he gets, looks happy generally. We'll be letting him back in the "caravan" tonight.
 
Good to read Mr Peckford seems to be on the mend.
I've been learning a bit about Oxine. It may be of interest to you.
https://www.shagbarkbantams.com/the-many-uses-of-oxine-ah-animal-health/
 
Thank you Shadrach.
This looks interesting but you can't get it from any UK suppliers... Which raises a whole of questions...
However that's a vood point worthy of more research.
 
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