Plastic Coops and Red Mite

[Margaid]

I'm getting more and more confused so I'm hoping some of the more experienced forum members can help.

I've been looking at plastic coops, recycled plastic board for making coops and talking to various people who make plastic coops. They all have a tendency to rubbish each other's products for a variety of reasons but there are issues that are causing me concern.

Two of the major manufacturers of plastic coops just clip the coop walls and roof together. As i understand it this means there is a gap for Red Mite to get into and potentially breed. (I'm also concerned about draughts but that's less important at present).

Ecosheet, when cut, exposes small voids from the core material, in which it has been suggested that Red Mite may breed and the manufacturers have not told me differently.

BUT, this afternoon I spoke to someone who makes coops from Ecosheet and was quite happy to answer my questions. I was quite staggered when he said that they did not seal the cut edges, and that yes they had exposed cut edges in the coop. I was told that all their researches had shown that Red Mite do not like plastic and will not breed in it.

So should I worry about the small gaps between walls and roof in a plastic coop or is this guy right when he says Red Mite don't breed in plastic? :?

Any advice welcomed - I'm going to see what I can find on the net but I'm hoping someone knows the answers.

 

[Marigold]

If you clip the coop wals and roof together, you can easily undo them for inspection when you give the coop a through clean, unlike wood surfaces which are fixed together but will still have a narrow gap where microscopic mites could congregate, or the joints in tongue-and-groove or feather boarding, which can never be reached. Draughts are not a problem. Lack of ventilation in a sealed coop is potentially much more harmful.
I can only say that I have never had red mite in either of my plastic coops, though maybe I've been lucky. I do keep them reasonably clean and sprinkle redmite powder around as a kind of libation to the gods, but am not neurotic about this, and maybe it will arrive one day. If and when it does, I'd rather take a plastic coop apart and deal with it immediately than mess about with creosote, etc. I think it's probably quite important to keep wild birds out of the run, which has a mesh roof, as a friend traced her first bad outbreak to finding a pigeon parked on a stool left in an unused coop, subsequently found to be crawling with redmite. But this would apply to coops made of any kind of material.

 

[dinosaw]

Hello Margaid

Marigolds post is a good one, any structure will have gaps large enough for redmite to congregate in whatever the material. I have had red mite in my plastic coop so can say that the idea that they don't like plastic is a myth probably perpetrated by manufacturers who have a vested interest in selling their product. Where plastic wins out over wood is the ease with which you can eradicate an infestation, simply take apart and treat for consecutive weeks, I caught mine early and was red mite free after two weeks. Exposed cut edges and indeed any type of hollow is a no no, no matter what the material as you simply cannot get at the little blighters (as I found with my hollow perches which I replaced) and they will live happily in their safe haven for many many months. Wild birds are a problem and it was roosting pigeons that caused my outbreak and I am now shooting them as a result. My tip would be permethrin based ant powder dusted liberaly into any joints, have had absolutely no problems since taking this approach. In my opinion plastic still offers the best option with regard to red mite.

 

[Margaid]

Thanks Marigold and Dinosaw.

If you've read some of my other posts you'll see that it was ease of cleaning plastic coops that attracted me. I thought I had read somewhere that red mite were found in plastic nest boxes so it seemed a bit odd. Added to that, the manufacturers of Ecosheet make no such claim I was quite prepared to seal any cut edges with car body filler as recommended by them. I suspect that the new manufacturer of coops made from Ecosheet can't be bothered with the hassle of filling the cut edges. I didn't really like the design either as there was only one vent at the front and the perches were in front of the nest boxes - he said the hens could pop out of the nest box straight on to the perch!!?? From what I've read on this forum the perch should always be higher than the nest box. A coop to avoid I think.

 

[Chuck]

Red mite will form a colony on the underside of plastic drinkers so it's not safe to assume that they won't colonise plastic coops. There seem to be some definate advantages to cleaning and dismantling plastic coops so the solution is to be vigilant and dust, dismantle, wash etc. to keep the little varmints down. I suppose the majority of manufacturers don't keep chickens so will never fully understand their needs and the problem of keeping them mit free.

 

[Margaid]

Most of the people I talked to today do actually keep chickens Chuck, even the one who told me red mite didn't live in plastic coops. If he starts using the coops he's making he may get a rude awakening. I've spent the last hour or so reading about red mite infestations and the occurrence in plastic coops - cleaning (which is easy) is the answer. I hadnt' realised the little horrors would hide under drinkers but it makes sense. I'm hoping to construct a shelter so that I can hang the feeders and drinkers to keep them off the ground and protected from the weather. We are fairly exposed to wind and rain so I need to provide daytime shelter for the birds. At the moment the mobile home is shuddering in the gusts; fortunately it is well chained down to a concrete base.

 

[Marigold]

It's a bit like buying those specialist vacuum cleaners which aim to pick up all the fine dust and allergens, isn't it ? No use at all unless used regularly - they don't prevent house mites, only help you to deal with them. Obviously, there is, so far, no material with mite-proof surfaces. However, the flat smooth surfaces of plastic sheet do not offer the myriad hideyholes that wood provides, and the fact that dismantling is easy simplifies treatment if mite occurs. I suppose my problem, if and when mite occurs, will be that I've let it develop unnoticed because so far I haven't had any and have got perfunctory about looking for early signs.

 

[chrismahon]

I am a wooden coop user and have to say that solid plastic must be inherently better for red mite because there are far less spaces for them to hide (plywood has the same advantage) as the mite congregate behind the framework of a weatherboarded coop and up inside the tongue and groove joint, which can't be reached without turning the panel upside down. The only way I can use wood is by creosoting, which takes time to dry and needs a spare coop in the meantime.

As for the foamed Ecosheet without sealed edges I would say once they have got inside it the only reliable solution is to dispose of the entire panel. We've had red mite in between stacked plastic plant pots -they went there after all the wood in the shed coop was sprayed. Thousands travelled about 6 feet from the pots to get to the hens, fed and then went back again!

 

[Margaid]

They shouldn't get into the core of the panel unless the outer skin suffers damage; any cut edges will be sealed with body filler and as the coop will be constructed before the hens are on site I would hope that the panels would be free of infestation.

I have decided there's no way I'm using a wooden coop which has joins allover the place. I'm realistic about myself and, although I start out with best intentions, if something is not relatively simple to do, then after a short while I won't do it properly. For example I am wonderfully tidy if everything has it's own easyily accessible place - if not the place soon gets to look like a tip and although I will then blitz it I understand that won't work with red mite.

What do you do with a large plywood panel if they get between the layers of ply Chris?

 

[chrismahon]

I seal all the edges of the ply with filler where required and paint them as well Margaid. I don't use much ply anyway. Previously I only used it on the nest boxes, which have painted bases to clean egg spills, plus tiny pieces which are creosoted. These new coops have a roof made of it as well and perhaps a floor. Problem with ply is it doesn't breathe, so you get condensation on the surface which readily turns to mould if the surface isn't treated with either creosote or gloss paint.

 

[dinosaw]

I find your concern about getting things right really admirable Margaid and you remind me of myself when I first decided to keep chickens. The truth is that you cannot control all of the variables involved in keeping chickens, i used to worry about how much they ate, whether they were drinking enough, whether they were bored etc. They are actually very robust creatures and unless you are willingly negligent to their needs then they will do fine, be happy and provide you with many lovely fresh eggs, in fact they are actually pretty hard to put out of their stride. If you were to buy a green frog or solway coop then you would not be going far wrong, those companies would not now be in business if their product was poor, equally people have kept chickens in wooden coops for hundreds of years . Red mite is a major concern IF IT OCCURS,once it occurs then it an be treated whether in a wood or plastic coop. In short i suppose what I am trying to say in the nicest possible way is dont think about it too much, you will drive yourself mad, just choose/build a coop and enjoy your chickens, I hope you don't take this the wrong way but I just wish someone had said the same to me when I was starting out.

 

[Marigold]

Excellent post, Dinosaw - let's all just enjoy our chickens, having done our best for them, as Margaid certainly will. If you have a no-quibble free returns offer from Green Frog, I think that speaks for itself, doesn't it?

 

[Sue]

Margain, I thought you may be interested to know this. Having taken my Green Frog completely apart yesterday for a spring clean, I inspected all the pieces and the only part where there are any hiding holes for red mite would be the ends of the perches. All the other parts have smooth edges. I filled the ends of my perches with superglue when I first had it, so now there is absolutely nowhere for mites to hide. It took 1 hour to take apart, thoroughly clean and put back together (2 people). I use newspaper in the house (thanks to Marigold's suggestion) and wood shaving in the nest boxes so this makes cleaning out even easier. I just take out any soiled paper every morning and replace as necessary. Very quick, easy and cuts down on the dust in the house.

Also I totally agree with what Dinosaw says! I spent months researching which house to have, spent hours and hours on the internet and visiting local retailers etc. I ended up with a house that I was very happy with (wooden with attached run), but then had to buy another house quite urgently and decided on the Green Frog. My first house is excellent quality etc., but as I said before, if I was starting again then I would only ever buy a Green Frog!

 

[Margaid]

Thank you everyone for your replies, advice and complimentary comments. I bought a 2 year old Solway Hen House on ebay this evening and as it has an internal nest box I can ditch that and fit an external Chick Box. I've been having fun watching the auctions for the Eglu Classic - they sell for high prices!

My longer term plans for chicken keeping mean that I will need at least another two hen houses which will house 3 or 4 large fowl each, so the secondhand Solway gives me the opportunity to find out whether that is the way to go. I might be able to call in at Bev Drury to look at the Green Frog when I go to pick it up which will give me another option.

I can also put this house at my friend's as I can't have my hens here yet - too much noisy building work still to be done. That way it gives them the chance to get used to it in their settled environment, rather than bringing them here and putting them in a strange house.

I originally posted because the chap using Ecosheet to build coops didn't seal the edges (see the thread about Ecosheet and Plywood). He was adamant that red mite COULDN'T live in plastic, only in wood but I had read of people finding them in plastic nestboxes etc.

I still intend to build a slightly bigger version of the "Poultry Palace" using Ecosheet as, at the moment, my girls love my friend's plywood version. I will be sealing all the cut edges as recommended by the manufacturer!!

 

[chrismahon]

This chap who tells you red mite couldn't live in voids in plastic needs a reality check. Perhaps he'll get one if we have a Summer this year?

 

[Margaid]

Yes I reckon he could have a rude awakening Chris. It wasn't just voids, he said red mite couldn't breed in a plastic coop - so what about in the litter? His comments didn't seem at all logical to me but I'm new to all this and on a very steep learning curve. Not my problem if he gets them!

 

[Marigold]

He's just trying to sell his coops to the unwary, isn't he? If he misleads potential customers like that, makes you wonder what his coops are actually like.
When do you get the Solway? Looking forward to a pic of it with your girls installed.

 

[Margaid]

I haven't collected ot yet Marigold - I'm trying to organise going to Bev Drury on the same trip but her opening hours are limited and the seller of the Solway works shifts!!

It's just the house - no run as I shall use electric netting. When I've sorted the nest box, and maybe changed the perches for wooden ones I'll try and get a photo but I'll probably get all the hens except mine in it. We're still building and at some point in the next couple of months will have heavy machinery moving next to where I want the big run. As Welsummers are not the most prolific layers I don't wan to reduce egg production by causing additional stress so I think they're better left where they are for the time being.

I'm consoling myself by kitten watching - stray cat I hadn't tamed enough to catch and take to the vets has two toms and one female about 7 weeks old and has moved closer to the source of regular food!

 

[Marigold]

Why would you want to change the perches for wooden ones? My solid plastic ones have all the easy to clean characteristics of the rest of the house. Quick scrub, wipe with old towel, all done. The ones in my Eglu were a pain - grid pattern, open section underneath hard to get into. Can't understand why Omlet make them like that.

 

[Margaid]

Thanks for that Marigold. I read somewhere that hens don't like plastic perches but I'm happy to take advice from experienced poultry keepers so, if the perches look big enough, I'll let the girls try them first. (Also think my friend who has my hens with hers said she didn't like plastic perches).