Confused Cockerel

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Hi everyone, it's my first post so hope I get it right.
I recently took on a number of ex batts from the BHWT. At the same time, they asked me if I would also take a cockerel and I said yes. I was told that the cockerel was a little confused as to what he actually is (sounds a bit like me really).
Anyway, the cockerel apparently is only 6 months old, I have him running with the hens at the moment. However, he gets picked on by almost all of the hens, when I open the doors in the morning, he is the first one out and takes himself off to a quiet corner of the garden for the rest of the day.
Is he just a little shy because of his age?
When is he likely to start doing , for want of a better phrase, the cockerel business? :oops:
When should I seperate him from the hens?
If I breed this cockerel with the warren hens, what will be the outcome of the offspring (as I believe they will not be warrens) ?

Sorry for all the questions at once but thought it was better to give you a view of the whole picture rather than slice the problem up into pieces. :oops:

Regards

Steve
 
Hi Steve, some birds are not mature enough until 12 months- if he is a slow developing breed then he will be dominated by the hens until he is old enough (and brave enough) to put them in their place- is he crowing yet? i bet not, as this is a sign of dominance :o He will sort them out eventually given a bit more time.
Why do you want to separate him from the hens? As to the outcome of the chicks, unless we know the breed then it's anyones guess :D Warrens are hybrids, so no, you will not be breeding warrens.
regards, David :)
 
Hi Davidd

Thanks for getting back to me, really appreciated.
I have worked out that these warrens are Bovans Goldline.
The reason I asked about seperating the cock is because I am selling the eggs produced (which have grown to quite a considerable number in the past week 40+/day) and obviously do not want to run the risk of including what may be fertile eggs.
I realise that any breeding from these hens will not produce Warrens as I believe that their offspring would revert more towards their parents gene's. (i believe they were a Light sussex and a RIR)
What i was a bit wary of was if that reversion would cause any abnormalities or unwanted problems.
So the plan is, all being well, to seperate the cock with half a dozen of the hens (when he is old enough) and see what the outcome is.

Cheers

Steve
 
Hi Steve, you will not have any problems with the off spring- they will just be cross breeds but still very useful egg layers with no problems so don't worry about that :)
regards, David :)
 
Hi Steve.

It turned out that I had 3 cockerels amongst my little group of 7 (unknowingly :o ) To start with they were all fine together but as they grew up 2 started vying for top spot, having little power struggles etc. But the third had a really hard time being bullied by the girls & boys. I just thought 'it' was the bottom of the pecking order, didn't realise he was a boy as he didn't look like the other two boys, he didn't have a large comb or tail feathers etc.

Anyway, everything came to crisis point one day when they all turned on poor 'Scruffy' (called that because he was, well, scruffy :lol: feathers all over the option!) luckily we were on hand to intervene before they nearly killed him. So we nursed him back to health, he started crowing proving he was definately male & started to grow into a beautiful boy.

I eventually found out he was (probably) an Araucana which are late developers, so as David says, yours might be just that, a late developer, so stick with him.


P.S. You can eat fertilised eggs. They don't develop once removed from the nest.
Good luck with him.
 
Davidd

Thanks, that's great news. I will be taking a lot more ex batts, probably working my way up to about 1000 or more eventually. In the meantime I wanted to get a little experience breeding from the stock I already have and just did not want to breed any defects etc. So your news that they will be fine is very welcome.

You are correct, he is not crowing yet, in fact he makes little or no sound at all, however, unlike the hens, he follows me around everywhere, lets me pick him up and eats out of my hand. That's unusual because although my OH can do exactly the same with the hens, they seem to totally ignore me (must be that man thing Lol).

Lucylou

Hi there

You may be correct in your assumption. The cockerel we got from the BHWT was not part of the rescue batch they had in, I believe it was one of a few that was reared independantly and were looking for a home for it.
If you dont mind, I will put a photograph of him up later today and hopefully someone may be able to recognise his type.

Kindest Regards

Steve
 
Hi Rookie,

A warm welcome by the way ;)

Are you really thinking of getting 1000 hens or is that a typo??

If so, I wonder why so many?

Although the basic Bovans Goldline is RIR x LS the battery hen has come from many tweaks by companies to get the best possible egg layers and feed conversion. The commercial companies effectively have their own 'breeds' now to get the number of eggs they do.

Crossing again will give you a hybrid that won't be particularly saleable and it is more likely the offspring will inherit the cocks laying abilities than the hens I believe. They won't be sex linked so you would end up raising cockerels to 8-10 weeks old and would need to dispatch the boys. Even top breeders find it hard to give away cockerels these days, that said I have managed to find homes for a few over the years.

Personally, I wouldn't breed from him with the Ex-bats - but he will be useful once he finds his feet at keeping the hens in order and will be a great personality. Just my view on things though :roll:

If you want to expand your stock through hatching, I would go for getting more Ex-Bats / pure breed hens or buying RIR / LS to make your own hybrid layer. You can have sex linked offspring then only raise the females and know your numbers at day old.
 
Ho Tim

No, it wasn't a typo, I have recently acquired a property in Cornwall which just happened to have 6 acres of fields with it. I'm no farmer, but it just seemed criminal sitting looking at these fields with nothing in them.
So we ended up looking at taking a few ex batts. However, when we started to see the condition of some of them, the odd half dozen or so that we intended to take turned into 60+.

It was hard to stop at half a dozen, each time we would see one that looked a little more distressed and we would have to include it. So now we have decided that as there are 19,000,000 battery hens in the UK (most of whom will eventually be coming up for dispatch) then we would just go ahead and take as many as we could accomodate and afford.

I reckon that the land would hold about 2500 and ideally I would like to fill it, whether my bank account or nerves could go that far is a different matter.
We also intend to possibly start a rehoming service from here and possibly in league with the BHWT in the future when we are more experienced.


I realise that there are many wonderful and beautiful breeds of poultry which are a joy to keep, however, when we see the benefits that our time and trouble has given these unfortunate animals, then everything else just pales into insignificance.

I am unsure as to how long these ex batts will survive, yet when we saw them running about in the grass for the first time in their lives or just lying in the sun under the tree's it made it seem worthwhile.

regards

steve
 
Hi Tim

It was interesting what you were saying about the warren hybrids.
I have done a little research into them and found out that in January this year, Hendrix Genetics bought out the old Cambridgeshire manufacturer of Warrens who produced the Bovans Goldline. As from that date, they are now known as Bovans Browns.

When I can work out how to do it, I will upload some photo's of them. It's interesting seeing the quills on their bare knecks going a dark (almost black) colour, I believe that this is the signs of blood filling their quills as they begin to re grow their feathers.

I also noted that when they first arrived they had huge pale pink combs. They are now shrinking and turning a deeper red. I believe that in the batteries they use the combs to dissipate the heat they generate and it is not untill they get out to free range that the combs start to shrink and change colour.

Even more strange is that a few of them show no signs at all of life in a cage, nice plump birds with full plummage yet even those ones show the startling amazement of running on grass for the first time.

As you can probably tell, we are hooked on ex batts, such a shame when I view some of the fantastic looking poultry on the pictures that many of the members have posted.


So I am in the process of applying for my authority from defra and the EMi to grade and sell eggs. The income generated will help to keep the batts in feed and also generate enough for new housing for the next batch.
At the moment I am selling them from the gate but not going fast enough, 13 dozen sitting in the garage waiting to be sold and growing at 3 dozen+ a day.
Must eat more omelets.
Anyway enough of that for now and sorry for rambling


cheers Steve
 
Pictures... Cockerel first, any idea what he is?

hens 005.jpghens 003.jpg


Large Combshens 016.jpg


Feather Loss and dark Quillshens 012.jpg

Will post more photo's in a few months as their condition improves.

Thanks

Steve
 
Hi Steve,

He looks lovely. As to what he is - ummm not really sure I'm afraid. Looks like a cross - a RIR in there somewhere and possibly some Leghorn seeing the floppy comb.

I am so pleased you are going to rehome so many Ex-Bats. That's fantastic and will be so rewarding.

I would be more than happy to try to pass on as much information as I can about them. I can also put you in touch with Jane Howorth the founder of the BHWT if you like, we have contact from time to time as we try to raise money for them on the Ex-Battery Hens page of the poultrykeeper site. We have raised £100 so far but we are a little way off our target of £250.

To be a success in the long term, I guess the 1000 hens would need to pay for themselves. It is tough selling that many eggs - perhaps you could consider a premium price with the right marketing? Ex bats will produce well for a while but after a year or so, they will lay thinner shelled eggs that break easily and will be harder to sell so unless you are going to change them after a short time, you face a deterioration in laying. You also have the vets bills to consider and a certain amount of losses.

Your best bet I guess would be to start a local selling scheme - something along the lines of Free Range Retirement / Rehomed Ex-bats that might attract enough people to buy the eggs in the knowledge that they are supporting your efforts to rehome Ex-bats?

The pink comb is a sign of anemia in chickens and it's not surprising in the conditions battery hens face.

Finally, as for the Bovans Goldline - although, this is a 'trademark' as such, many poultry keepers call the RIR X LS hybrid a Bovans Goldline or just a Goldline (a bit like a hoover is a vacuum cleaner...) I'm sure the real thing commercially is something that originated from these breeds but is now effectively it's own breed - but unless you want to buy them by the thousand, I bet you wouldn't be able to get them as a hobby keeper. You probably have the real thing as ex-bats and we have the RIR X LS by a smaller breeder.
 
your cockerel seems to be hen feathered. No pointy saddle feathers and his tail seems very hen like whereas he seems to have the head of a mature male. maybe he has some kind of hormone imbalance? although in some breeds males are hen feathered and a some breeders breed hen feathered game birds from normal birds.
 
Hi Rookie,

I bet your rescued chickens think they're in heaven! Can't wait to see the next lot of photos. I only keep pure bred chickens at the minute but think everyone on this forum enjoys seeing well looked after birds whether they are a rare breed or an ex- bat. :D

Like you I would say that anyone who watches a group of chickens strolling about in the sun and rolling about in a chicken hot tub (dust bath!) would very quickly change to free range eggs.

Look forward to an update ;)

Nicky
 
Hi mightymohan

Yes that's what i thought. Apparently he was put into a battery cage for a while, the farmer thought he was a hen. It was the daughter of the lady from BHWT who offered to rescue him and two others as the farmer was going to dispatch them.
So I suppose at that time, he must have looked even more like a hen. I assume this comes of messing with the genes of these hybrids. Though you would have thought that as they are colour sexed at day old, he would have looked at least a little different.
I will have to look around Cornwall for someone getting rid of a decent cockerel and just keep the gay fella in the hope he might mature.

pebojunp

Thankyou, I too cant wait to see how they improve, have plenty of "before" photo's so looking forward to taking some "After" photo's to compare. Even now I realise I must be doing something right because I can see the improvement daily.
No matter how many ex batts I get, I dont think that feeling of doing them a good turn will ever dissapear.

cheers

steve
 
Errr----Steve ----Does he crow? My first impression was the same as MightyMo??RoS
 
Hi podstable

Nope, he doesn't make a sound, other than some times he growls like a dog when i walk near him.
Totally coonfused, any ideas?

cheers

steve
 
You mean them brown round things that come out the back end?,, errmm No! Lol

He doesn't do anything, just runs out of the shed in the morning and is a pain to put back in on a night time.

cheers

steve
 
Ah didn't realise he was in a Battery.. so if he made it to a Battery Cage, chances are, he was born from the same parent stock as the hens.. but he must have been born the right colour or he would have been culled and not made it as far as the cage...

(S)he does look the right colour to be a hen...so yes, could be a hen with a hormone imbalance as suggested?

I've never seen one before but hens can start to crow..
 
Hi Tim

I was told that he did make it into the battery cage along with two or three others. So obviously the colour sexing did not work out in his and his brothers particular case.
The farmer obviously spotted something was wrong after a short time and was about to despatch them when they were rescued.
He has no spur growth (only a small lump where the spurs should be), he only has one wattle, and as I say, he makes no sound whatsoever apart from a throaty growl at times.
Do I have a 6 month old queer cockerel or is it some sort of Frankenstein Created Woman model.? Lol

cheers

steve
 
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