Protein levels in feed

[Chuck]

Follow up from another thread really.

I have access locally to three makes of feed and I list the protein levels of the following:

Layers:
Marriages 17%
Haygates 16%
Humphries 17.4%

Growers:
Marriages 15%

Chick:
Marriages 18%
Haygates 19%

Haven't looked into any of the other constituents like vits, mins, fibre etc. but just thought it interesting that feed that we think is very standardised does have some variation.

 

[chrismahon]

Chuck. Just posted in the other. Allan and Page smallholder is 16% protein in both layers and rearers/growers. We just need 'Garvo' and 'Dobson and Horrell' for a decent picture of the quality stuff. We used D&H chick crumb as has no ACS but I haven't kept the label.

 

[cuwiar]

Hello, have just found this on http://www.gardenfeathers.co.uk/1055-garvo-alfamix-for-chickens_p448.aspx

Description
1055 Garvo Alfamix for Chickens is a complete feed for adult chickens, and one of the finest on the market. Rather than pellets only, the mix comprises pellets, seeds and small amphipods. This adds interest for the chickens and makes for a more balanced diet.

Composition:
wheat, sorghum, soya dehulled extracted toasted*, maize cracked La Plata, maize cracked, broken peas, rape seed extracted, maize gluten feed, lime stones, spinach seed, wheatflakes, shell grit, barley, carrot pellets, millet yellow, sunflowerseed black, safflowerseed, millet red, oats peeled, dari white, dried amphipods, rape seed, linseeds, buckwheat, soja oil*, brewer's yeast, lecithin*, softacid

* from genetic modificated soybeans

Analytical constituents
crude protein 15,4 %, crude fat 5,6 %, crude fiber 5,3 %, crude ash 10,2 %, calcium 27,28 g, phosphorus 4,15 g, sodium 0,91 g, 6,64 g, 2,7 g

Addition/kg (Vitamins)
E672 Vitamin(e) A 12500 IE, E671 Vitamin(e) D3 2500 IE, Vitamin(e) E 66 mg

Addition/kg (Traces)
E4 cupper (cupperchelate from amino acids, hydrate) 6 mg, E4 copper (copper(ll) sulfate pentahydrate) 5 mg, E5 manganese (manganese chelate of amino acids hydrate) 39 mg, E5 manganese (manganous oxide) 39 mg, E6 zinc (zinc chelate of amino acids hydrate) 20 mg, E6 zinc (zinc oxide) 20 mg, E1 iron (Ferrous sulphate, monohydrate) 56 mg, Selenium (organic form CNCM 1-3060) 0.13 mg, E2 iodine (Potassium iodide) 1 mg

Addition/kg (pigments)
E161g Canthaxanthin(e) 4.4 mg, E161b/h lutein(e)/zeaxanthin(e) 3.4 mg

Don't know if it is any help?

 

[foxy]

Garvo varies quite a lot between layers 14.9%, breeders 17.5% and growers ranges between I think 18% (hen grower) and 25% (cockerel grower

Most of mine have just come of growers (Garvo) and are now on breeders (Allan and Page)

Calcium is higher in layers pellets than growers formulations.

 

[Marigold]

Hello, have just found this on http://www.gardenfeathers.co.uk/1055-garvo-alfamix-for-chickens_p448.aspx

Description
1055 Garvo Alfamix for Chickens is a complete feed for adult chickens, and one of the finest on the market. Rather than pellets only, the mix comprises pellets, seeds and small amphipods. This adds interest for the chickens and makes for a more balanced diet.

/quote]

Garvo Alfamix is lovely but quite expensive compared with their layers pellets - about £15 per bag ompared with £9 for layers. I bought some a week or two ago by mistake, I meant to get Alfachick for my quail (19% protein, they need a higher level than hens) ) but asked for the wrong thing and got Alfamix, so the girls are having that for their afternoon treats for a while. Alfamix is a mix of various seeds, grains and minipellets with added dried shrimp, sort of dried mealworm lookalikes, probab;ly accounts for the higher cost, and the hens go mad for it. Alfachick has tiny pellets and small seeds and grains, looks like very superior muesli. Would be nice for a few special chicks if you could afford it.

 

[Castle Farm]

Have any of you any idea what a chicken needs in it's daily life to function, remembering that the bird could be a grower, either bantam or large fowl. It could be a bird prior to laying or breeding. It could be a bird just in or just out of a feather change.

This 'one size fits all' approch by feed mills leaves a whole lot of questions that need answers.

Why do the feed companies need to put all these additives in the mix.

What happened to chickens that used to live on just grain and what it could find in the way of free food (as many still do in most countries without bagged feed).
What effect does the amount of calcium above and beyond the birds actual needs on the liver and kidneys of the bird.

What effect do the chemicals in the feed have on the food chain after the eggs or meat is eaten.

Do any companies still put hormone inhancers in the feed to induce more egg production in the hens and if so do these chemicals have an effect on puberty in children?.

DO YOU TRUST the people at the mills to correctly mix the crap they put in the feeds you are feeding to your birds?

The next time you give your children a nice eggy breakfast just think what goes into your hen to produce that egg.
Your feeding them some of this...WHY?
Addition/kg (Traces)

E4 cupper (cupperchelate from amino acids, hydrate) 6 mg, E4 copper (copper(ll) sulfate pentahydrate) 5 mg, E5 manganese (manganese chelate of amino acids hydrate) 39 mg, E5 manganese (manganous oxide) 39 mg, E6 zinc (zinc chelate of amino acids hydrate) 20 mg, E6 zinc (zinc oxide) 20 mg, E1 iron (Ferrous sulphate, monohydrate) 56 mg, Selenium (organic form CNCM 1-3060) 0.13 mg, E2 iodine (Potassium iodide) 1 mg
Addition/kg (pigments)

E161g Canthaxanthin(e) 4.4 mg, E161b/h lutein(e)/zeaxanthin(e) 3.4 mg

Unique product code: GV-1055 - please quote this code if you want to make an enquiry.

 

[chrismahon]

Some of my opinions on the points you have raised Castle Farm:-

Based on what I have read, too much Calcium in young chickens causes kidney failure. So it is very important that chicks get crumb and not mum's layers pellets and after that important they go on to growers/rearers and best until they lay their first egg, at which point they need and can process the extra calcium for the egg shells.

You can be more confident of the constituents if you buy the non-commercial (small keeper) brands. The general stuff I know contains the government approved and permitted yolk 'enhancing' chemical colourants (which they don't mention on the egg boxes). They also contain GM crop derivatives. But they are cheap, so you pay your money and take your choice.

You can mix your own feed using the recipies given in old poultry manuals -any pre-1960. But the time and cost makes it impractical I think.

I thought hormone additives were now banned? The latest hybrids lay enough without them anyway.

Garvo produce a range of feeds taylored to chickens of various types and in various stages of development. I don't think anyone makes a feed for layers that are moulting, but a table spoon of maggots (white only) each works wonders. I'm sure the other small producers will soon follow suit, as some are beginning to.

The exact mix at the mill is beyond my control so I have to take it on trust -or mix my own feeds.

 

[tygrysek75]

From the list of ingridiens Garvo using GM soya in their pellets.
I do agree that there is to much unnessesery additives in chicken's feed.This is propobly used to blend all ingridiens and maybe stop fats go rancid to quickly.You need to be a chemist this days to know whats all E number mean,not to mentions what on earth go to human's food 01

 

[Chuck]

Chickens have been moulting for years on normal rations, even farmyard hens which were expected to find most of their own feed daily free ranging. There is more than a tendency among newer poultry keepers to treat the moult as a disease instead of a normal process of renewal.

To take up a Castle Farm point or two: firstly I'd say you have a point in that bantams, high yielders poor laying show stock have different needs. Most of the compound feeds have been designed for high yielding hens and there are a lot of hens being over fed. Add to this all the treats which may be high protein or may have high calcium levels and there are many on a very unbalanced diet. Feeding is not an exact science as can be seen by the variety of protein levels in some of the feeds. To mix your own feed can be difficult to get the balance right if you want a good constant supply of eggs and usually works out more expensive.
Luckily, chickens are very adaptable to many situations and feeding regimes but by now my views on overfeeding are well known I should think !

 

[victorias poultry]

I feed mine Gibsons Layers Pellets which are 16% protein. They also have a handful of wheat in the evenings (especially now when it is getting colder) and layers meal which is wet and available all through the day.