northern fowl mite/neck lice/vent gleet

[elmdene]

It's that time of year again - I'm off on holiday in a few weeks and suddenly my little flock of 3 chickens have all these health issues.....
One of my pekin girls still has an ear infection which I have given up trying to cure and just bathe and clean out every few days. This could be a secondary infection due to something else. She also has had this thing a few times where a bit of poo hangs out of her vent on what looks like a thread of intestine. Yesterday I noticed this because her egg had some blood on it. I washed the poo off and the bit of tissue seemed to spring back in - yuk! When I googled it I realised that both of my girls have probably had vent gleet for some time - a moist white discharge around the vent. The treatment recommended was an antifungal cream such as Canesten or athletes foot cream. Can anyone confirm that using human creams on chickens is ok for them and not too strong? I have also ordered some Beryl's Friendly Bacteria (they both had antibiotic injections a few months ago) and will also start giving them ACV again.
Secondly....I have also just noticed that the feathers right at the top of their powder puffs, just above the preen gland, are dark grey at the base (easy to see as the girls are both white pekins). I can't see any signs of lice so am I right in assuming that this could be northern fowl mite? I have tried dusting them with mite and lice powder but so far no change, although it's only been about 3 days. I was thinking of giving them a spray of Frontline but am now considering Ivermectin as this has the added advantage of worming them, which they do need. (I hate having to keep them shut in for a week on Flubenvet treated pellets). I know neither Frontline or Ivermectin are licensed or desirable, but would this be a good course of action?
Thirdly.....Basil, my pekin cockerel still has a bald neck. The vet reckoned it was just feather pecking, and he does put his head down for the girls to peck at sometimes, but I wonder whether this is to alleviate the irritation from feather or neck lice? He had suspected northern fowl mite in January which I treated with Frontline. The feathers did start growing back but now they are all gone again and it looks quite sore, apart from him not looking as handsome as he would like. I have tried dusting with mite and louse powder with no effect. Would the Ivermectin work on this, or would Frontline be better? Should I spray directly on the affected skin or would this sting? Obviously I wouldn't use both, and Basil also has the dirty dusty area in his tail.
I should add that otherwise they all appear quite happy. The girl with the ear infection lays quite big eggs for a pekin I think (45 - 55g) and the other one lays smaller, round eggs, sometimes soft shelled. (These do go a rather strange texture when poached - translucent greyish bubbly whites (rather than solid white) with a very pale yolk - quite unappetising. They seem fine cooked any other way though. Does anyone know why this is?) The girls have always had some underlying respiratory problem and I can't turn them on their backs as they don't seem to be able to breathe that way up and just gasp and gurgle madly. They absolutely refuse to perch at night however many times I have moved them, and just sit cuddled up in a nesting box together. (I wonder whether the ear infection in Fluffy is to answer for this - maybe she can't balance?) Basil has also started doing this, which is what made me look for mites/lice.
Sorry for such a long rambling post but wanted to paint the full picture. As ever, any advice very gratefully received. I have spent so long googling all this that I am now thoroughly confused! 07

 

[Marigold]

Be catious about using Frontline, as it's a Prohibited Substance which its illegal to use on any food-producing animal, so strictly speaking you shouldn't ever eat the eggs or meat from birds treated with it. As your birds are pets I don't suppose you intend to eat them, but you need to know that eating the eggs is at your own risk thereafter, and you shouldn't give them away or sell them to anyone else. See this article by Victoria Roberts
(The part about Frontline is on p.4.)

http://www.chippingnortonvets.co.uk/modules/downloadspl2/files/Backyard%20Poultry%20review%20JSAP.pdf
I imagine Ivermectin comes with similar warnings. I know vets do prescribe these sometimes under the cascade. I quite understand that you want something effective for your birds, and that's fine so long as you realise the possible egg withdrawal problems and allow at least several weeks before eating any.
As for the vent gleet, if you're sure that's what it is, well obviously it won't get better without antifungals, maybe it would be good to just check it out with your vet that it was safe to use canesten etc, and whether there would be any unexpected interaction if the birds were also being dosed with fipronil or ivermectin at the same time. They must be feeling rather uncomfortable, poor things, and of course you want to treat them ASAP with whatever seems most likely to work, without causing other knock-on problems. As several things seem to be happening here, you might consider a vet consultation so you feel all bases have been covered!

 

[elmdene]

Thanks - I had read this article before and as I happen to be very close to Chipping Norton vets I called them recently to see if they had any vets specialising in chickens, but they said not - strange.
I got some Ivermectin but as the treatment is a drop once a week for 3 weeks I am unable to use it at the moment because I will be away on holiday. The vet therefore recommended a dose of Frontline, sprayed onto a piece of cotton wool and dabbed around the vent area, underarms and back of the neck. She reckoned this was better than spraying in one area which makes sense. If this hasn't worked by the time I am back, she said try the Ivermectin. (Her take was that the reason lots of these drugs aren't licensed for use on poultry is because it would cost the drug companies so much to test them, and that if properly used, they are ok). I have also powdered them liberally with louse/mite powder and it appears to be getting ever so slightly better, but this may be wishful thinking. I will have to wait for 2 weeks now.
I agree with the article though when it talks about being aware of your chickens' health. I do try to inspect regularly but my girls hate it and they are just so fluffy it's difficult to get right down to the skin. It was only when I gave Fluffy a bath that I realised the extent of the damage. She had hardly any feathers around the sides of her bum and what I always thought was just poo stuck on her feathers right at the base, may indeed be mites.
The vet also said vent gleet is a herpes virus so anti-fungals won't clear it; it needs something like acyclovir. There seems to be conflicting info about this on the forums, but as it apparently smells strongly, it may not be what my girls have after all.

 

[chrismahon]

That's an interesting article Marigold. The 'Frontline' residue in eggs was evident after oral administration though. My vet said it was perfectly acceptable to dose on the skin surface and advised a precautionary 14 day egg withdrawal. Which agrees with the article because the yolks take 14 days to grow. Good idea applying it with a cotton bud though -something we have done in the past to avoid the eyes. Frontline is brilliant at killing NFM and remains active in the applied area for 3 months in our experience -we got a repeat infestation in completely different areas on one cock.

 

[Kimbab71]

I too am having problems with neck mite/n.fowl mite. I took one of the chickens to the vet last night (the scraggiest looking one) and we couldn't really see anything. But having tried everything else, the vet has given me Ivemectin to put on them.
The dosage is 5 drops per bird then in 21 days another 5 drops. Total egg withdrawal from first application is 28 days. Does this sound about right?

 

[chrismahon]

The product is unlicensed for chickens Kimbab71, so I don't know about the dosage. But the egg withdrawal is usually 28 days from the LAST application.