Man vs. Mouse

[rick]

Just had a very full on day building new nest boxes and perch which involved the materials from the existing provisions so it was a race against roosting time.
The local mouse population has exploded this year (so has the sparrow pop.) Its not all my doing – our neighbor puts out a lot of food for the birds too and between us it has been a bit to much of the easy life for squeakers. Anyway, the trouble has been having stuff against the sides of the run which just happened along the way looking for places for nest boxes and stuff. The first were under the eves of the pitched roof we have over the run – worst place possible to mouse proof behind! The hens gave up on those nests a wile back and it seems obvious now as I found the evidence of the mouse night club behind the ply that closed the gap under the eves at the back of the nests.
The second location was closer to the floor and under a small table that was handy for putting things on going in and out of the run but that was also a nice place to hang out with a relatively easy climb to the run floor.
A flat roof would defiantly be easier to apply ½” wire netting up to!
So, Ive taken everything out so that it is clear walls up to the roof and made a pair of nest boxes with a table top roost above as a free standing unit in the middle of the run. Now, at least, I can survey the perimeter and try to foil their plans. I’m taking it as a good sign that since I took apart the old nest boxes they have had to resort to digging a tunnel from outside the run, under block paving and up into the dustbath which is sunken into the floor. It is lined with brick but not very well – needs some mortar round the sides.
The, probably crazy, idea is that I cant keep them completely out (though it should be easier now to try) but I can make it quite a hair-raising challenge to get out from the run floor with nowhere to hide during the day when it will get uncomfortably like Jurassic Park!
There was a bit of a commotion at roosting time with the chooks (mainly Bonnie who prefers to walk) trying to work out how to get onto the perch now the ramp has moved.
I’ll get some pictures tomorrow.

 

[Tweetypie]

Can't wait to see the pics. I've been lucky so far. Just a vole that keeps popping up outside the run. The run has paving slabs with a 1cm rubber sheet on top. Makes it easy to lift out and hose down. Nothing can get inside.

Isn't there any mouse poison that hens won't eat?

 

[rick]

Its defiantly the way to go, Tweetypie, to keep them out. I compromised my block paving when I put in the dustbath and wasn't careful enough not to rush the job with gappy brickwork. Otherwise the run is tight blocks with a two brick course of wall around the base except the extension I put in which is also brick up to the rear garden brick wall but, again, a bit sloppy how it meets the wooden frame of the run. That was another historic rush job!
It is so good to plan everything from the start but it just doesn't happen that way - The original thought, allow space to the side and behind for maintenance but that is valuable space unused so ends up as the hasty extension.
There was some murmurings and moving about by Lulu when I opened the back door earlier tonight and I think it was a mouse that had gone up the ramp onto the table that supports the roosting bar. I had got away with that before as their perch was a bar suspended from the roof. Another hasty fix - supporting the ramp with a gap to the table. With the high bar that couldn't happen as there was no table under it so a mouse would have to get onto the perch with the chicken who would have a peck at it.
I haven't been keen on poison as they may try to eat a poisoned mouse even if they didn't eat the poison themselves. Too risky, but I have had a niggling suspicion that eating mice (or mouse droppings) may have contributed to the recent problems with some.
... but I am hopeful that the mouse clan will will be looking for a better party venue pretty soon!

 

[rick]

Here it is! I have covered the sides of the nest boxes with some hessian cloth for the moment - needs something better fitted but wanted to make the sides removable. There was extra space between the nests when separated by the length of the perch so I made the Auboise hopper fill the gap. There is a gap under the hopper and nests that a mouse could hide in but some mesh round the bottom will be easy enough.
The string that the feeder is hanging off is pretty shabby - it used to hang off the bottom of the old nest boxes and roosting shelf that were the main problem being fitted under the eves.
Now everything is off the sides and I just need to brick up the tunnel into the side of the dustbath and watch for other routes in and out.
Something funny happening with the attachments - I'll try one more post of the other side then give up!

 

[rick]

 

[rick]

I must admit I'm impressed by mouse tunnel making. The only way in through the floor was a missing half brick where I didn't have enough to go around the dust bath hole and finish the paving square. The start of the tunnel is at least 2 metres away. They couldn't have planned the route from A to B (could they?) so there must be a good few more tunnels under there that didn't result in striking lucky. What was clear is that they had hit the good edge of the dustbath underground and then followed the wall round. They didn't go down under the wall which is 3 bricks below ground but then the blocks were laid on a bed of sand so that layer would have been easier to dig. I wonder how they get the soil back out of the tunnel as they go? Keep kicking it backwards on their way through I guess.

... I'm just wittering on here...

Went out with the touch after dark and there is a mouse in a bit of a panic running around as there is very little cover at floor level and it hasn't worked out a plan B yet. Ive left a milk bottle in there with some grain in the bottom at 45 degrees so hopefully Ill have caught it in the morning rather than the hens taking it on. It seems to be working to some degree.
This hopper system for the Auboise keeps the chooks busy and entertained (they scratch to empty the hopper for the bit of grain mixed in) but it looks like I would be getting through two bales a week! So, recycle, and Ive made a poop separator out of a mesh basket that is shaken to speed up the operation by the cordless drill. The poop clumps float to the top while the relatively clean Auboise falls out the bottom into a bendy bucket to go back in the hopper.
I think I'm all burnt out of innovation for a while now!

The other good thing is that now they have a mat under them again when they roost (for the first time in at least a year) I can easily see all the digestive 'evidence' in the morning and the huge quantity of feather sheath 'snow' that they are making.

 

[bigyetiman]

That all looks lovely.
We have just had a bit of a "mousemaggedon" here also, they can create impressive tunnels as we found out.
We realised when the local Tawny and Barn Owls started paying far more attention than necessary to our garden, especially around the hens area.
We wondered where they put the soil, you would think a pile would appear outside wouldn't you?

 

[Tweetypie]

Love the pics. I was intrigued by the sh#t shaker 10 10 It would be fun to get a camera inside the coop to see what goes on at night :? You would be able to see just where the mice come from. I think..

 

[rick]

Maybe they do the thing of having holes in their pockets and distributing it evenly round the garden
It is officially now known as the sh#t shaker - and here it is

Just tall mesh basket. I thought the drill (with an allen key as an eccentric weight) would speed it up but the quickest way is just shaking vertically up and down by hand. Still poop picking but the hopper needs a bit more filtering to be as free flowing as fresh. Auboise is actually very dusty stuff - good idea to use a scarf as a mask when doing it though the dust must be a relatively large particle size as the chickens scratch around in it a lot and it never causes any trouble to them.

Of course, I'm not suggesting any of this is wise or necessary!

 

[chrismahon]

We stopped using Aubiose in the dry months Rick because we found it too dusty and it did affect the chickens- they are prone to flapping about in the mornings. At that point we switched back to wood shavings in the coop (and now only use newspaper- glossy magazines are even better).

I made something similar to your shaker to go over our vegetables to keep the chickens away. Those covers came with us and are still being used.

 

[Tweetypie]

I can see where you are coming from now, Rick. I wasn't quite sure why you needed the sh#t shaker, but now realise that like most on here, your chooks are in an enclosure with dark bedding. My poor husband has to pooh pick by hand, with a shovel. I reckon I might keep them in a big enclosed area through winter and get OH to make the famous Rick S#it shaker. I'm sure it will make his life easier ?

 

[rick]

The battle continues...
I think I have stopped them digging in. Its quite obvious where they do as there is a clear spot on the bedding on the floor and a corresponding gap in the paving/tunnel below.
Have been leaving the trail cam in the run the past few nights and they are still having a party in there! Its been good to note that the one meter of half inch mesh does give them trouble to climb. They jump and run up about a third of it but then turn back - its obviously an effort for them to climb the whole distance though Ive no doubt they could in a crisis.
There are some places where they can get through the gap between the woodwork and wire where the timber is sitting on the low wall around the base but I suspect their 'front door' is in the extension at the back of the run because one ran that way earlier when I looked in as the chooks were settling in on the perch.
Part of the problem is the heavy duty wire that I used to fox proof in a hurry as it is really difficult stuff to work and though it has totally fox proofed it makes for a lot of badly fitting corners to cover with finer mesh. If I could Id take the whole defenses apart and re-line with neatly fitted and servicable panels but that would be an epic job!

The gaps between the base and the wire are vertical gaps where the wire isn't completely tight against the frame and brickwork. I can fix that (and will) but they don't seem keen on going that way for some reason. I think they are cautious when the smooth face of the beams don't give much to grip on and they might fall down. Again, they could do it, I'm sure but there is an easier way that I haven't found yet. Pointing the camera in every direction in the run and extension is going to take some time! Feels like a border intelligence operation! They are a very cute foe

 

[Icemaiden]

Hmm. They're cute when they're somewhere else. They're not so cute when they chew through plastic water pipes that're buried under a floor or in a studwork wall...

When we converted an outbuilding into a studio last year I had a heck of a job finding a plumber who'd lay in copper water pipes rather than plastic ones for just that reason.

Hope you beat the little blighters Rick. Thought about keeping a few owls??

 

[LadyA]

You know what I've discovered??

The last couple of weeks, my cats have been obsessing about an electrical outlet on the living room wall. Just the one. They ignore all the others. Now, when we moved into this house, one of the outlets didn't work, and we had an electrician in to investigate. He found a mouse skeleton behind it! He said that it happens occasionally. In one house, he had found four mice, nose to tail, all electrocuted! So I was suspicious, but tbh, didn't pay over much attention.

We've had some fierce storms the last few weeks. The other day, I was out at the side of the house where the electricity meter is. The lock for this meter has been gone since before we moved in, 20 years ago. So, the cover flaps. But now, around the ground outside, there were loads of the tiny insulation beads! opening the cover, I discovered a hole had been gnawed in the side of the cover, leading into the wall of the house! So, that's obviously how the mice got in. I'm thinking of using expanding foam on that, and have now sealed off the actual cover. And will enquire about getting it repaired/replaced. And will not think about the dead mouse/mice in the wall!!

 

[rick]

Agh! Yeh! Haven't had problems of chewing through wire and pipes. Maybe if I do succeed in keeping them out of the run they will get a bit more desperate for something to chew.
They are defiantly using the rear corner in this shot. Maybe I can hypnotize Bonnie into thinking she is an owl. She looks a bit like one in the early morning

 

[Marigold]

Maybe I can hypnotize Bonnie into thinking she is an owl. She looks a bit like one in the early morning

She's not the only one!

 

[rick]

Just thought I would update on this ongoing saga.
I have given up on having the hopper for the chooks to scratch the bedding out of themselves. It does take them longer than it would to find scratch that was just scattered but not that much longer! Did discover, though, a good way of putting scratch under the surface of 'bedding', some 22mm plastic pipe with a funnel on the top. Fill it with scratch and stir around in the auboise and the pipe empties - keeps them busy scratching for just as long.
So the hopper that I had built into the new perch and nest box unit, to get it all away from the sides, to make it harder for the mice to use to get in, I took out today. There was a triangular gap under it that I had sealed off with mesh (or thought I had) and when I upturned the unit today they had built a nest in there!
However, there was only one mouse on camera last night so at least thats a good sign. DPC (damp proof course) is slippery black plastic on a roll that is pretty cheap. They don't seem to be able to climb it (just like an 8 inch band) up or down if it is fixed to the wall. Otherwise they quite happily run up half inch weld mesh to at least a metre.
I know this is obvious, and I had an inkling in the summer, but the smell of mouse near a nest box will put them off laying in there. Very sensible and probably learned from millions of years of experience for birds. The reason for them shunning the built in nest boxes last summer seems obvious now.

Nesting isn't an issue at the moment. The last to molt was Mo. Now she has quit laying we have no eggs Bonnie seems determined to keep eating discarded feather cases and is as runny pooped as ever but tail up and seems OK otherwise. Lulu's big comb is pale and shriveled -she and Mo look like they have been dragged through a hedge backwards but Pom is getting a new outfit of feathers. I took their rings off quite some time ago and am hping that I will be able to tell who is who from their combs as the new feather outfits could be very different... Mo might not be the one cappuccino on top anymore!!

 

[LadyA]

My girl that had an almost full moult in the Autumn went through a hard time with the other hens w hile moulting. She was very bullied, and they wouldn't let her near the food. I had to feed her sneaky feeds in the house by herself, while they were all getting their evening feed out in the run. And I gave her extra in the mornings, in the house, once they were all gone out. Thankfully, now that she's fully feathered again, there's no problem, and she's back feeding with them. Hens are just weird! :roll:

 

[rick]

I cant work them out! Sometimes, when one is looking under the weather the others seem to keep them company but whether that is actually what is going on..
It is roost time that gets me. Occasionally, because of being there at the time, I am foolishly tempted to try to settle perch squabbles by rearranging them. Not a chance! - the one that was being pecked starts pecking the new neighbor and its into another round of musical perches. At which point I give up and say 'Well it will be too dark to see each other in 10 mins so you can all just get on with it! G'night!'

 

[bigyetiman]

OH learn't that you can't rearrange hens on a perch, you just have to let them get on with it and once it is dark all is fine. a lot of it with ours is just posturing. She has two old timers 5 & 6 who get on one end of the perch and just look disdainfully at the bickering, conveniently forgetting that used to do exactly the same.
OH had a friend phone up today and ask if we had a humane rat trap, as they had one rat ( that's what you think) and they wanted to catch it and release it in in a field at the back of them. Her reply was "yes I have but be careful with it as it will break your fingers if it goes off with them in the way, and rats come in bunches like buses you have more than one" She just rolled her eyes after that call