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Wet droppings (grey green)

Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 11:18 pm
by rick
Does anyone have any insight for Bonnie's condition?
I would presume that she had been eating a lot of greens on a hot day - but its been going on for a while now (a month or so), its not that hot and it is continuing through nearly a week of Flubenvet (no greens.)
When this session of worming is done I'm going to give them all a dose of Avipro Avian.
She may have been eating feathers as both Pom and Bonnie have molted - crop is always full, sometimes squishy and other times firm but consistently full. She is still within the usual range of weight though at the lower end (she normally ranges from 3.2 to 3.8 kg)
She stopped laying a few weeks ago but went into a moult so to be expected. She is a bit withdrawn but that, I think, is just the moult and keeping away from me picking her up and massaging her crop!
I'm thinking that the most likely cause is a bit of a feather blockage.
... I know it sounds like I'm answering my own question but whats worrying me is that it was about this time last year that she went off lay - fine, needs a break i thought, weeks passed and suddenly realised that her weight was in free fall. Diagnosed with a mild peritonitis (odd) but I suspect that was just a symptom or secondary problem that started with the weight loss? Totally guessing - don't know! I'm watching her much closer this year.

Re: Wet droppings (grey green)

Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2018 8:42 am
by LadyA
One of mine had very wet droppings for a while, but then she went into a heavy moult and stopped laying, for which I was thankful, as she'd started laying eggs with such thin shells they got broken or eggs with no shells at all, which is very hard on them. Since stopping laying, although the moult is hard on her, she's been fine otherwise.

Any time anyone shows signs of runny poop here (well, any of the chickens, anyway!! :D :D ) I put Oreganico in the water for a week, and I've always found that great for sorting it out.

Re: Wet droppings (grey green)

Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2018 8:54 am
by MrsBiscuit
That's reassuring as well LadyA.

I'd keep on monitoring her Rick, orps do tend to suffer through and after the moult as they have so much feather, I think it really takes it out of them. Giving her a tonic is an excellent idea, it should give her a boost. The thing I'd really keep an eye on is whether she has sour crop or an impacted crop. The crop should be full during the day but empty first thing so perhaps one determined early morning examination might be in order, then leave her alone, I imagine having feathers grow through is uncomfortable and just generally lowering. I had one bird that got sour crop with monotonous regularity, she was never a good doer.

Re: Wet droppings (grey green)

Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2018 1:03 pm
by Hen-Gen
Now I usually refrain from commenting on threads such as these because I have very little to say. Now I realise that one can become very attached to animals and want to do the best for them. Also good stockman ship is essential and if you can’t offer that then you shouldn’t be keeping animals.
Having said that however I would not ever want to make anyone feel guilty, particularly those on low incomes, for drawing a line where costs become prohibitive. For me no chicken is going to be taken to the vets with the ensuing cost. If it’s a problem I can’t cure myself then it’s chicken soup.
As I say I have no problem with people spending their money as they wish but some threads offer unrealistic solutions to health problems. If it’s a choice between a trip to the vets or a new pair of shoes for your child then the answer is obvious.
I rently garnered some criticism for mentioning that in the past whenever I had a dog die then it was double wrapped in bin bags and put out for the dustman. For me at this stage it is just dead meat. No one would suggest the the turkey carcass at Christmas should be given a woodland burial in a pet cemetery!
Sorry if these sentiments cause offence. It is nothing to do with disrespecting the living animal. It is acknowledging that the life force has gone. So when I snuff it call the knacker man. I’m perfectly happy for my body to be reincarnated as a tube of Evostik.

Re: Wet droppings (grey green)

Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2018 6:12 pm
by LadyA
tbh, Hen Gen, when any of the chickens here get sick, they get 48 hours on oreganico to see if they start to turn around. If they don't, I cull them. If it's runny poop, I give them all a week on oreganico, it usually stops it, especially if (like this last time) it seems to be something to do with coming into/going out of lay. If it doesn't, then the "offender" is culled. In the early days, I did take chickens to the vet, but there isn't a good avian vet around here, so I felt like their guess was as good as mine! It might sound heartless, but I know chickens can be very ill indeed before they start showing any signs. And brown girls are prone to things like peritonitis, I've lost a few to that over the years. If I suspect peritonitis, then they are culled immediately. No point in dragging things out, it's not fair on them and causes unnecessary suffering.

Re: Wet droppings (grey green)

Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2018 6:46 pm
by Marigold
Its a relief to hear that other people whose opinion I respect think along the same lines as I do. I used to feel that I had a moral obligation to keep my old hens going until they dropped off naturally. But II've come to feel that what I owe them is the best of care whilst they are healthy, happy and laying well, and then a swift end when things begin to go wrong. Because birds have such different metabolisms to mammals, cannot easily be anaethestised or operated on, and often hide illness until it's too late too help in any case, even a good vet can often only tell you as much as an experienced poultry keeper could - and will then prescribe undesirable antibiotics, in the hope they will help. On the whole, chickens get gut problems, bronchial problems, infestations or egg laying problems. The first three can largely be prevented by buying healthy stock, feeding sensibly, cleanliness, routine worming and providing airy coops with ample ventilation. Egg laying problems such as prolapse or peritonitis are not curable, and I think euthanasia is the kindest way to go. I don't find it easy, though.

However, I understand and respect the views of people who feel differently about their much-loved chickens as pets, just as I feel about my dog. If dogs only cost about £15 and i had several of them, would I be prepared to dispose of them when they got ill, rather than take them to the vet for expensive tests and treatments? In the end, does it just come down to the place the pet has in your life, and in your heart, as a companion and friend? There still comes the point when you have the responsibility to take that final, awful decision and say goodbye - it's just that this is harder to do for an animal who is truly part of the family. Some chickens do fill this need, as do many other species. So theres no ned to feel guilty, whichever camp you belong to - unless, of course you know in your heart that your chickens' sickness or demise was actually the result of neglect or lack of care on your own part.

Re: Wet droppings (grey green)

Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2018 6:50 pm
by rick
Thanks all.(and Marigold, you posted while I was writing)
Im guessing Origanico is a probiotic LadyA?
Agree with all, Inc being made into a tube of Evostik :)
In my own experience, going to the vet has been part of the learning curve of knowing what is treatable or not. It's been a mixed experience - some things even a good vet can do very little (if nothing) about even if they can positively identify what is wrong.
But knowing that it's the end of the line and nothing reasonable (and affordable depending on what that amounts to) can be done is the trick!
I have not, however, been able to cull them myself so far dispute knowing the sense of it. After my last trip with Aerial when I stayed with her through the procedure I vowed not to do it again - chickens are not easy to put to sleep like a cat or dog. Not that Aeriel knew anything of the difficulty after the first couple of seconds.
I could have saved her a car journey though.
Anyway, I'm trying to avoid being in that situation, if reasonably possible, with Bonnie at the mo and, I think, her number is not up just yet!
It would be nice if she got her digestive system in order before growing a new pair of pantaloons :)

I do feel I should say this though - any situation of what we we would normally think of as a peritonitis (an egg peritonitis usually) is not reasonably treatable even if success is a possibility (which it almost invariably isn't.) However, I am glad that I did decide to try with Bonnie last year as it was obviously not the usual forgone conclusion. It did involve antibiotics (as pills so only she had them) but we are not in a global mess because of that kind of use. We are in a mess because the poultry industry made a routine habit of treating 20,000 bird flocks as a precaution (and pigs, and sheep, and cows, and humans with a bit of a cold) right through the 50's, 60's and 70's and dumping the surplus and arisings down the drain. They wouldn't have been impressed by the soft notion of a pet chicken either.
Anyway. There is an evolutionary reason for grief so its pretty unavoidable. Thats a lot of plastic in the landfill. Keeping chickens is a delight. I don't really get social media I think. XXX

Re: Wet droppings (grey green)

Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2018 10:49 pm
by LadyA
Oreganico (and Herban) is a strong oregano oil. Oregano oil has natural antibiotic properties. It may be coincidence, but it does seem to have been helpful several times in clearing up runny tummies. I suppose because there wasn't a serious underlying cause.

Re: Wet droppings (grey green)

Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2018 10:56 pm
by rick
Thanks LadyA. It must be down to the wrong gut bacteria for some reason. Her crop has been going down but there is a ball of something in there and I'm thinking feathers still.) You mean antibacterial properties! Sounds good!

Re: Wet droppings (grey green)

Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2018 11:00 pm
by LadyA
rick wrote:
Thu Oct 11, 2018 10:56 pm
Thanks LadyA. It must be down to the wrong gut bacteria for some reason. Her crop has been going down but there is a ball of something in there and I'm thinking feathers still.) You mean antibacterial properties! Sounds good!
Yes, I meant antibacterial! Got auto "corrected"! :-)01