Contaminated eggs

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Eggs withdrawn from sale contaminated with Fipronil, (Frontline.) I expect the problem is quite common in commercial eggs.
Best to grow your own, I think - and to use other methods than spot-on to treat parasite infestations.
https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2017/aug/05/aldi-pulls-dutch-eggs-in-germany-as-insecticide-scandal-widens
 
Read the article as well. If you grow your own you know exactly what has happened to it, be it animal, vegetable or mineral, although it is not an option for some people.
 
Interesting to read this having seen many forum topics on using frontline for chickens over the years with people advocating it's use, I will add that I have never been in favour of using it. Had a quick google search and after just running through four threads I had read three containing posts from people claiming that fipronil doesn't enter the bloodstream so doesn't effect eggs and therefore doesn't have a withdrawal period, two of these claimed they had got this information from their vets. If it has been detected in eggs then that clearly can't be the case and yet again makes you wonder about the vets.
 
I've never read anything that suggests fipronil doesn't enter the hen's bloodstream and hence into the egg, although there has been some controversy about how long the withdrawal period should be after treatment and before eating the eggs. I think that on here we've always advocated extreme caution about its use. I suppose it's OK to use it on pet birds where you're not ever going to eat the eggs anyway, but along with antibiotics, I wouldn't ever consider using it on my flock.
I notice the Guardian article mentions 'red lice' - is this a new hybrid of redmite x chicken lice? Or just an author who knows little about keeping poultry?
 
I was just about to post this .....

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-40841411

.... when I saw your post Marigold.

I have been banging on for years about the risks of using Frontline on chickens and at various times have been poo pooed by those who think they know better. I also wrote to Victoria Roberts about it and she agreed with all I said and her reply was published in a smallholding magazine some years ago.
Hopefully now people might start taking notice.
 
The thing about these spot on treatments are that you need to be careful with them, even with dogs/cats. I know that some of the ones suitable for dogs can cause severe illness or even kill cats. Which is why I'm not a fan of using them on chickens.
 
Now it's possible some of the eggs may have been on sale, or used in commercial food production, in the U.K.
300,000 Dutch hens have been culled unnecessarily and some poultry farmers face ruin.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/aug/07/eggs-contaminated-with-insecticide-may-have-entered-uk-eu-warns
I'm glad I not only know where my eggs come from, (70 steps from the kitchen) but which hen laid each one, and what it was made of.
 
It's ridiculous to cull the hens. They are not infectious. Why can't the farmers wait through the withdrawal period then start collecting the eggs again?
 
I understand that a lot of the birds that've been culled were meat birds, so the egg withdrawal period wasn't an issue. The only consolation that I can draw is that all of these birds would probably have been culled at 6 weeks of age anyway, to go into ready meals & to provide cheap tasteless meat, so they've not died much sooner than they would have done anyway.

If these birds are being reared in huge barns & despatched at 6 weeks or so, I'm surprised that the "farmers" don't just jet wash or steam clean the buildings between batches to get rid of red mite. No need for Fipronil that way...
 
I wonder how they applied it? Fipronil is Frontline, which is usually applied by individual spot-on to each bird or dog etc. Surely this wasn't practical with industrial numbers of birds, but if they sprayed it around they would have had to use a very high dose to get it to wet the feathers down to the skin where it would be effective. There's also a long withdrawal time on meat from treated birds, so it's not just eggs potentially at risk.
There was some bloke on the telly yesterday trying to 'reassure' people that it was perfectly safe to eat the contaminated eggs and there was absolutely no need to worry, despite the same item reporting the possibility of damage to your kidneys, liver etc from ingesting Fipronil!
 
I was wondering that, how they applied it, and came to the same conclusion it must have been liberally sprayed on. if that is the case it must have been a hell of a lot as it takes a long while for rain to get through to a hens skin. I have some that positively revel in getting soaked then can do the woe is me look
 
Well however it was applied, and over what period, it's in the eggs.
I think the problem Marigold is that in the UK the contaminated eggs were used in processed products some of which have already been consumed by the public. They are obviously trying to prevent panic when people realise they may already have ingested some Finopril. As I understand it you have to consume a high level for a long time for it to affect humans; let' just hope that's true!
 
On another forum they have a sticky on external parasites, a lot of disclaimers about their advice and statements in red saying that Frontline is not licensed in poultry and shouldn't be used without the advice of a vet followed by this little gem.

Babe got this information from the vet:

Quote from: Babe
I love my Vet, he's fantastic.

OK so here's what he said about frontline for chickens.

although not licensed for poultry in the UK, it is widely used and found to have great results.

use cat, kitten or puppy strength.

3-4 drops for large fowl.
1-2 drops for a bantam or smaller chickens.

Never use on a chick until fully feathered - then only 1 small drop!

always place on the back of the neck, some people will say under the wing - do not put it there!! back of the neck only.

it will kill all mites and give about 3 months cover on poultry so can be used quaterly as a preventative measure.

has shown wonderous results on scaly leg mites.

you will need to treat all your poultry the same day, to prevent cross infection

a good spray of jeyes fluid the same day in all the crooks and crannies of your coop is also advisable.

Frontline doesnt get into animals blood stream so should not affect eggs, but he says that until its poultry licensed he wouldnt like to say for certain, maybe wise to give them 5-7 days to err on the side of caution.

hope that helps.

The blind leading the blind!. It shouldn't get into the eggs, but he can't be sure mind you, even though he's a vet and paid to know about animal physiology and all that sort of gubbins.

In fairness if a vet tells you something about animals you ought be able to confidently defer to their opinion so it's not the posters fault. Surely if it isn't licensed on poultry then a vets advice ought to be, don't use the bloody stuff.
 
To be fair, 'not licensed for use on poultry' doesn't necessarily mean that it is actually harmful to poultry, just that not enough research has been done into the effects of the substance on the target group, and especially its secondary effects such as transmission into meat or eggs, though of course I totally agree that it's good to err on the side of caution. Commercial chicken farming usually relies on an 'all in, all out' management policy, whereby a batch of pullets is moved into a shed which has been cleaned and disinfected after the previous 'crop' has been slaughtered at quite an early age. Having been inoculated as chicks against common diseases, any birds that subsequently succumb are simply culled and not treated - a different situation to domestic poultry keepers, who often prefer to try to treat individual pet birds when they can. If you're just treating a pet bird with a nasty infestation, probably that would be OK so long as you didn't want to eat the eggs, - just the same as for Ivermectin. But of course that's not so for commercial outfits, so money for research studies that would establish to what extent fipronil is actually safe on egg laying birds, or on meat birds, is not undertaken because it's not cost effective. Until now, it has been presumed that commercial chicken farms would simply not use it, as it's quite expensive compared with other forms of parasite control. I find it puzzling that apparently, so many in the industry have been doing so, since as has been said, it would be extremely difficult to apply as spot-on to hundreds of birds at a time.
Fipronil is licensed for use on dogs because it is effective against some common parasites (though not ticks) and can now be bought across the counter rather than only on prescription from a vet. As nobody in this country eats dogs, it is claimed to be safe provided that the owner is very careful when applying it, so it doesn't come into contact with human skin. The implication is that it can penetrate human skin just like canine skin, or be ingested from fingers which haven't been washed and which come into contact with the mouth.
The other spot-on treatments which are used on dogs and cats that do deal with ticks are only available on prescription from a vet, so are presumably even more potentially dangerous to human health. The most recent development in this field is called Bravecto, which is given in pill form to dogs and claims to provide complete protection, including from the more dangerous kinds of ticks, for up to 6 months. However, there is much controversy over its use, since it does not only affect skin but has to travel throughout the dog's digestive and organ system and affects the nervous system as well, in one large dose, from within. Hundreds of people worldwide have reported severe and even fatal reactions in previously healthy dogs, and there's a long-running Facebook site entitled Does Bravecto Kill Dogs? with all the details. I have had a long-running argument with my daughter over this, as her vet recommends Bravecto and her dog appears to tolerate it, but I am more cautious with my little terrier, having read all the research!
https://www.facebook.com/groups/411371212394679/
 
I use Broadline on Greta (our cat) and she is always a bit off colour the next day, apparently frontline doesn't work on cats anymore.
 
Frontline didn't work on my kittens - they came with fleas, or the eggs anyway and I ended up having to spray the carpets because it didn't work. My vet prescribes Stronghold which is Selamectin and is applied topically to the back of the neck. Mischief, like Greta (above) is always off colour the next day. Why? If these products aren't absorbed into the bloodstream, then how come the indications are Prevention of heartworm disease; Treatment of adult roundworms and Treatment of adult intestinal hookworms? These are in addition to fleas, ear mites and biting lice.

I haven't had to use it this year; I comb Mischief regularly with a flea comb and haven't found any evidence of fleas. Believe me, if he had fleas I'd be getting bitten!
By the way, it's manufactured in Belgium!
 
Bloody Belgians! :D

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PrvXoin9NcA
 
Plastic Bertrand, Marouane Fellaini, Dr Evil, moules frites. Just cancelled out all your positives. :lol:
 
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